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So uh... guys... what do you think about Sony's 'Move' controller? [roundtable]
 
Sony announced the official name at GDC earlier.

Blatant wii-mote rip-off? Or something entirely new?

Discuss.

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Posted: 03/11/10, 21:42:24
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It will fail to capture the public's attention for the same reason the PS3 has failed to capture the public's attention. It costs too much. Sony needs to be including this new controller with every PS3 sold and have a killer app to go with it.

I miss 'the Wii is a fad' days.
Posted: 03/11/10, 21:48:46
C-c-c-copypasta!
Looks like they have some interesting software (amongst some really uninteresting software). They might have missed the point by making everything so complicated, though. There wasn't too much middle ground between "Color in the linez" and "Fight to the death, jab, jab, punch, power up your super-meter, follow the QTEs, YAAAAHHHH!!", except for the Wii knockoffs. That augmented reality stuff looks pretty cheesy, just like it did on Eyetoy. I don't really want to stare at my own terrorist-like countenance while I play a game. Plus, I usually play in the dark.

Intriguing, though. I don't think Natal can top it, but we'll see, I guess.


Additional Observations: That dude playing the boxing game seemed like he was going to pass out after 30 seconds of play.

Also, Sony might very well take motion controls farther than Nintendo (while sacrificing popular appeal), because they don't seem to care if everyone can play every game. They've always been more apt to cater to a niche, and I am personally in the 'interested in complex motion control' niche.

I didn't really care for the aesthetics of any of the games shown. Most were fairly hideous, stylistically.

It's funny that they're trying to lure away Nintendo's third-party motion support. What third-party motion support? Beyond a handful of EA titles, the quality pickin's are pretty slim.
Posted: 03/11/10, 21:57:05
I don't think it's going to be as much of a threat as people think unless it effectively replaces the SixAxis/DualShock 3 as the main PS3 controller. Like bpumpkin said, it needs to be included with every PS3 sold from here on in order to do so.

I'm in the blatant WiiMote-Nunchuk-WiiMotionPlus rip-off. We'll see how developers handle it.
Posted: 03/11/10, 21:58:15
i think theyve done a good job in creating the device and all that surrounds it. even if it somewhat is ripping off nintendo... but what irks me the most is the reporting on kotaku about it. i dont read much elsewhere for industry wide news, but ffs. its like open-market games are acceptable now because sony are doing them, and they are nitpicking every little detail to try and find some little (if what false) reason as to why the 'Move' is better than the wii controllers. for instance this paragraph

-The Z: Without a Wii MotionPlus, the Wii Remote cannot accurately sense depth.The Wii's sensor bar doesn't know how close the player is standing to their TV, nor can it recognize movements toward or away from it. The PS3, however, can detect such movement in the Z-plane. It does this thanks to the sphere at the end of the controller. If the player moves the Move toward themselves, the PlayStation Eye camera sees the sphere shrink and therefore knows the controller has been moved in the Z-plane. Clever. [UPDATE: Readers point out that a standard Wii Remote can sense some depth. I have even played games a long time ago that ask for the Wii remote to be pulled in or out. I never found that detection to be all that precise and believe the PS3 Move, based on how the tech was described to me, should be able to detect Z-plane movement more effectively, without needing to be pointed directly at the TV, as the Wii Remote must be.]

(me again)
thats utter bullshit, the camera would not track the "size" of a ball any more accurately than the wiimote camera can track the distance between LED's on the sensor bar. its from this article http://kotaku.com/5490574/how-the-playstation-move-is-not-a-wii-remote even the article title pours will bullshit.

If anything, the "move" has more limitations than the wiimote, the camera only has a refresh rate of 120hz, which is evident in [url=http://www.gametrailers.com/video/gdc-10-sony/62930]this video[/url] that it easily misses fast movements. to which i believe developers are relying to heavily on the camera rather than the accelerometer and gyroscopes for tracking. im not totally clued up on things but demonstrations talk a lot more than tech specs as you can see a visual representation of what drawbacks can be.

all in all, i just trust nintendo to sort out the odd ends more than sony.
Posted: 03/11/10, 22:23:31
It's a great idea with nice implementation, but as stated earlier, $100 is a little steep. They need to release a killer app, and include it for free, (like Wii Motion Plus, or Wii Speak, or the second controller in Wii Play). At least drop the price to $40...but if it costs almost as much as 2 games...I may have to pass.
Posted: 03/11/10, 22:27:43
It has the potential to be a massive fail. Here are my thoughts.

1. Too expensive. They announced the Playstation Eye w/ Move for $99. What does that even get you? Does it include the nunchuk add-on? The Eye by itself is $35. Does that mean the controller will cost $64? It appears that in many of the games demo-ed, you need two controllers. That must mean it will cost over $150 just to play most of the games. That's a whole lot of money for something you don't even need to enjoy your PS3.

2. That globe on the top looks very vulnerable. How many times have you whacked your wii remote on the coffee table or a wall? I'm not sure how that orb could take a hit like my wii remote has received.

3. Publishers won't want to develop for it because they will lose money. Any game with Wii motion controls is going to cost a developer a lot of time and money to upscale and remake the game to work on Move. Sony says that a lot of publishers have signed on, but that doesn't mean anything. Publishers like the Wii because it doesn't cost as much to develop for it.

4. Nintendo can just lower the price to $150 and wrap their finger a little tighter around the casual market. A $300 game system requiring $150 of add on product just to get the motion controls is not as convincing as a $150 wii.

5. Hardcore PS3 fanboys have already built up a strong resistance to motion control and it might be hard for them to reconcile a purchase. If the fanboys are not on board, this thing could fail early and huge.

6. Too much Wii copying. There isn't anything that the Move does significantly different to the average consumer to justify.
Posted: 03/11/10, 22:32:17  - Edited by 
 on: 03/11/10, 23:18:46
Chozoman said:
It's a great idea with nice implementation, but as stated earlier, $100 is a little steep. They need to release a killer app, and include it for free, (like Wii Motion Plus, or Wii Speak, or the second controller in Wii Play). At least drop the price to $40...but if it costs almost as much as 2 games...I may have to pass.

$100 = "sports" title game, Motion controller and subcontroller, PlaystationEye

to compare
Wiiplay + Wiimote = $50
Wii Nunchuck = $20
(no wii camera to include) but i would speculate that if there was one it would be around the $20/$25 mark
in total that would be $90/$95.

soo frankly is it such a bad price point?
Posted: 03/11/10, 22:34:13
@weeman_com

I thought the starter pack did not include the subcontroller?
Posted: 03/11/10, 22:42:07
anandxxx said:
C-c-c-copypasta!

It's funny that they're trying to lure away Nintendo's third-party motion support. What third-party motion support? Beyond a handful of EA titles, the quality pickin's are pretty slim.
Precisely. Where Sony will fail utterly is they will not be able to lure away Nintendo's motion support. That will be Move's un-doing.
Posted: 03/11/10, 22:43:12
anandxxx said:
C-c-c-copypasta!
Yeah that.

Oh wait, you were referring to your post.
Posted: 03/11/10, 22:46:14
It'll probably work ok, I just don't see PS3 owners rushing to it. And honestly, if you look at the games on the PS3, most of them are Sony produced or only exist on the PS3 because it is easy to port from the 360. With Move they lose that easy portability from 360 edge as well (unless developers start making NATAL/Move games, but those seem too different for that) so it comes down to Sony to fully support it.

And you know what? As much as 3rd parties think Wii-exclusive games don't sell, I'd like to see how well they fare with PS3-exclusive games. I just don't think there is a big enough market on the PS3 to sustain that.
Posted: 03/11/10, 22:50:09
Phalanx said:
@weeman_com

I thought the starter pack did not include the subcontroller?

im assuming that it does, whats the point in selling a starter pack when almost all games will require the subcontroller (especially as their not sure if it will have an accelerometer or not, which could fit as the 2nd motion device for games that are not specifically designed for 2nd controller input)

Simbabbad said:
weeman_com said:
-The Z: Without a Wii MotionPlus, the Wii Remote cannot accurately sense depth.The Wii's sensor bar doesn't know how close the player is standing to their TV, nor can it recognize movements toward or away from it.
Funny, the Wiimote did exactly that in Elebits, a near launch game, and Trauma Center. Hell, it did with Monkey Ball Banana Blits, which was a launch game. And WiiPlay's billiard.

And this, gentlemen, is why I never read "gaming journalists" sites. Complete and utter lies/incompetence.

Anyway, yes, it's a ripoff, and the superiority is far from obvious. Still, the potential to play with a pointer as an option in standard games (RE5, stuff like Killzone) is quite great. Is the pointer functionality all that responsive, though?

Commercially I see a huge failure.
awww god dont get me started on kotaku, i swear they are so biased its unbelievable.
its the same reason why i hate people with double standards, its ok if i do it but not when you do. its ok when sony/microsoft does it but not nintendo (who innovate in doing so)
Posted: 03/11/10, 22:51:50
weeman_com said:
Chozoman said:
It's a great idea with nice implementation, but as stated earlier, $100 is a little steep. They need to release a killer app, and include it for free, (like Wii Motion Plus, or Wii Speak, or the second controller in Wii Play). At least drop the price to $40...but if it costs almost as much as 2 games...I may have to pass.

$100 = "sports" title game, Motion controller and subcontroller, PlaystationEye

to compare
Wiiplay + Wiimote = $50
Wii Nunchuck = $20
(no wii camera to include) but i would speculate that if there was one it would be around the $20/$25 mark
in total that would be $90/$95.

soo frankly is it such a bad price point?

I stand corrected. I did not know it included a game.
Posted: 03/11/10, 23:02:35
weeman_com said:
Phalanx said:
@weeman_com

I thought the starter pack did not include the subcontroller?

im assuming that it does, whats the point in selling a starter pack when almost all games will require the subcontroller (especially as their not sure if it will have an accelerometer or not, which could fit as the 2nd motion device for games that are not specifically designed for 2nd controller input)
It doesn't, but you can use a DualShock 3 or a SixAxis in its place.
Posted: 03/11/10, 23:10:06
I didn't watch the conference, like usual, but this doesn't seem very exciting to me. The only thing that might perk my interest is if its use in SOCOM 4 is worth it. If companies will go this long without creating a third-person shooter from the ground-up with motion control, then I may just have to go with Playstation Move's $100+ for that. Stupid game developers.
Posted: 03/11/10, 23:12:49
I think I like it?

First we're waving our wii's around. Now we're waving our balls around....

This is a joke..right?
Posted: 03/11/10, 23:14:39
This isn't the first and won't be the last time Sony blatantly rips off Nintendo. I hope it fails, hard.
Posted: 03/11/10, 23:19:57
I honestly do like it quite a bit but what I don't like is Sony and their disgusting tactics. Completely pretending that someone else didn't already invent and eventually perfect this technology is so ridiculously underhanded and unprofessional.

The sad thing is I think by so called hardcore gamers this might get more support. Now I'm not saying the Wii is dead or that the PS3 will all of a sudden start outselling the Wii but I think games like Socom, RE5, and whatever they have up their sleeve like Uncharted 2 Move Edition can sell a ton. IF Sony's smart (obviously they are completely ripping Nintendo off again and again and again) they'd rerelease PS3 games like MGS4, Uncharted, etc for use with the controller. I'd buy em, I won't deny it.

But again my hate for Sony has yet again increased. THIS is why I've hated this company from the start. The Playstation 1 was amazing but even back then the company itself pissed me off so badly. Then imo the PS2 was overrated and barely anything special and now the PS3 is even worse so I just have no problems hating Sony.
Posted: 03/11/10, 23:20:00
carlosrox said:
IF Sony's smart (obviously they are completely ripping Nintendo off again and again and again) they'd rerelease PS3 games like MGS4, Uncharted, etc for use with the controller. I'd buy em, I won't deny it.

well IF they were really smart, to push the hardware, they would get these games patched for free for Move support. if my understanding is correct, Socom will work with dualshock and Move for a normal retail price, so why not get free patches for the older games rather than making existing customers repay for old games

BTW everytime i read your name, i misread it, i see it as Carlo Sex
Posted: 03/11/10, 23:28:22  - Edited by 
 on: 03/11/10, 23:30:39
Blessthismess said:


5. Hardcore PS3 fanboys have already built up a strong resistance to motion control and it might be hard for them to reconcile a purchase. If the fanboys are not on board, this thing could fail early and huge.

Here's the thing about the true PS3 fanboys. They listen to ANYTHING Sony tells them. Remember when Sony said "No one wants Backward Compatibility anymore?" Yeah, now the mantra is "I can just go buy a PS2 for cheap, no big deal." HD was only suddenly super important when Sony said it was. So I don't think this will be an issue, since they'll be on board if Sony says it's the thing to do. (Of course the Wii will still suck because it isn't in HD, which again is super important.)
Posted: 03/11/10, 23:29:28
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