I loved the original, downloaded and never played the second one though.

I don't have Banjo Kazooie anymore for N64... I sold it.... for what I can't remember but I think I got bored with it after I collected everything.

When I did have it, I did enjoy it - better then DK64 that's for sure..

I never played Banjo Tooie - wasn't interested..

S

I loved Banjo-Kazooie back in the day, but I never beat it. When I went back to it recently, I didn't like it nearly as much. I find the constant collecting to be boring. It never bothered me in Super Mario 64 though. I can go back to that game any day and have tons of fun with it, but Banjo-Kazooie bores me.

You know, collecting is not an inherently bad gameplay mechanic. When done well, it's essentially a "reward" for a platform challenge, like how the Stars in Mario are similar to reaching the flagpole in the old games. In SM64, you'd get a star for eight red coins, which were generally smaller challenges that encouraged scouring the level. The B-K games pretty much did something similar, where exploration is rewarded with "doodads" and it appeals to a lot of gamers' needs to "clean out" a level. Similar to the feeling of accomplishment I get from scouring a Zelda dungeon and making sure I get all the treasures and visit all the rooms.

TriforceBun said:

You know, collecting is not an inherently bad gameplay mechanic. When done well, it's essentially a "reward" for a platform challenge, like how the Stars in Mario are similar to reaching the flagpole in the old games. In SM64, you'd get a star for eight red coins, which were generally smaller challenges that encouraged scouring the level. The B-K games pretty much did something similar, where exploration is rewarded with "doodads" and it appeals to a lot of gamers' needs to "clean out" a level. Similar to the feeling of accomplishment I get from scouring a Zelda dungeon and making sure I get all the treasures and visit all the rooms.

Yeah, except when they make you collect things arbitrarily to progress. BK didn't do this very much, Tooie did.

TriforceBun said:

You know, collecting is not an inherently bad gameplay mechanic. When done well, it's essentially a "reward" for a platform challenge, like how the Stars in Mario are similar to reaching the flagpole in the old games. In SM64, you'd get a star for eight red coins, which were generally smaller challenges that encouraged scouring the level. The B-K games pretty much did something similar, where exploration is rewarded with "doodads" and it appeals to a lot of gamers' needs to "clean out" a level. Similar to the feeling of accomplishment I get from scouring a Zelda dungeon and making sure I get all the treasures and visit all the rooms.

Counterpoint.

I actually preferred Tooie to the original. I guess I enjoyed the larger scope or was simply more ignorant of any design flaws back in the day. It has been several years since I've fired up my N64.

The problem I had with Banjo, that I believe other people had, is that there is really no sense of satisfaction with collecting things. Literally everywhere you look on the screen at any given time there is something to collect. It also felt arbitrary in a sense. First off, I have to collect notes in order to open up doors to advance further in the HUB world...but then I have to collect Jiggies in order to open up more worlds. Ok. Well, then there are the Jinjos who once you collect a certain number give you a Jiggy. Then you've got these other things. Then more. Then suddenly there's something else. And it just keeps going. I never felt the platforming was all that good, either. I realize it was a N64 era platformer, certainly didn't walk in thinking it was Galaxy level, but it just didn't even feel Mario 64 level.

Mario keeps it simple. You collect stars, which open up more areas which unlock more worlds. You collect 100 coins to collect a star. You collect red coins for a star. Everything goes back to stars. It doesn't hit notes, then Jiggies, then kind of jump back and forth like some kind of game.

Speaking of, that game at the end was a TERRIBLE idea. I went through the game in like 3 days (first couple of Jiggies I did, then stopped for a week) and I couldn't even remember half the stuff. And this was after getting everything in it. So I'm suddenly punished because I can't remember what Grunty's favorite food is on the fourth Tuesday of every odd month? A W Esome.

@missypissy
Speak for yourself. I love collecting stuff in games. I even liked DK64. I beat it twice at 100%.

@warerare & anyone else who has/is playing Nuts & Bolts:

Anyone up for some multiplayer? There's about half a dozen achievements in the game that can only be unlocked through Multiplayer and apart from the "Win 20 ranked games" they don't seem that tedious. It'd be nice to have at least one fully completed game under my belt (achievement wise).

There's time difference issues involved but I'm usually avaialable on the weekends, meaning Friday/Sat night for you guys.

@Shadowlink

I would like to play Multiplayer but need to play through the main game first in order to unlock all the component parts for vehicles. I think the acheivments fall under ranked battles but i suppose if we are the only people playing then it should pair us up.

I will try and get the majority of the game finished by the weekend.

@TriforceBun I agree, sort of. I don't mind collecting in any of the DKC games for the Super NES; I'm even fine with DKC3, which seems to be considered the start of Rare's excessive collectathon-creating. I just can't get into Banjo-Kazooie's approach anymore.

@warerare

Yeah, I think we would be. I went hunting for games last weekend and NO-ONE was on. Not a one. Was annoying.

Yeah, I never found anyone playing Nuts & Bolts, either. Or Mr. Driller. :(

I guess I'll start playing and hopefully pair up with you guys... one day :(

@missypissy

Eh, either way, you're only either collecting notes or Jiggies. Not a big deal, IMO. In Super Mario, you're either collecting coins or Stars. I dunno... to each their own.

The core gameplay is pretty solid, and the pacing of the game is good too. This thread has pointed out that *THAT* particular aspect got sort of ruined in the sequel, but I can't comment on it yet since I haven't played it.

Hmm, I never knew the sequel was such a collect-a-thon. As stated above, I really only missed Tooie because it released at a point I wasn't gaming at all. But maybe it was for the best. I couldn't stand Donkey Kong 64. I liked all the core gameplay, but the collecting was annoying.

Pandareus said:

TriforceBun said:

You know, collecting is not an inherently bad gameplay mechanic. When done well, it's essentially a "reward" for a platform challenge, like how the Stars in Mario are similar to reaching the flagpole in the old games. In SM64, you'd get a star for eight red coins, which were generally smaller challenges that encouraged scouring the level. The B-K games pretty much did something similar, where exploration is rewarded with "doodads" and it appeals to a lot of gamers' needs to "clean out" a level. Similar to the feeling of accomplishment I get from scouring a Zelda dungeon and making sure I get all the treasures and visit all the rooms.

Counterpoint.

Thanks for the link, that was a very good and interesting read.

how would you guys rate from least to greatest, Mario 64, Banjo Kazooie, Banjo Tooie, and Donkey Kong 64?

@autokymatic

That's a hard question... I'd have to play them all again to confirm. This is hard for me this question.