* * * * * Chrono Trigger - Week 5 * * * * *

(Plain English: Scroll down to the bottom of the "OP" if you're lagging behind for previous weeks)


TABLE OF CONTENTS
Prologue:
i Okami Club
ii Fire Emblem Club

Epic Center:
01 Ogre Battle
24 Secret of Mana
39 Phantasy Star IV (cont'd)
67 Earthbound (cont'd)
99 Breath of Fire II (cont'd)
110 Paper Mario (cont'd)
123 Golden Sun (cont'd)
136 Chrono Trigger

(ALL VINTAGE EC GAMES ARE CONTINUED IN THEIR OFFICIAL DISCUSSION THREADS!)

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *


Hello, true believers! Welcome to Negative World's newest RPG-centric Club Hub, springing off the heels of the Fire Emblem Club. Way back when, Nintendo Power introduced a monthly walkthrough / in depth Role Play Game section (right around the beefiest SNES RPG era), but since they aren't around anymore to use it, Negative World will bring it out of the ashes, dust it off, and roll with it (two things of note: #1, this is not in reaction to Nintendo Force Magazine at all -- I know that because I thought of it in the shower this morning, so THERE; and #2, I just looked up "Epic Center RPG" on Yahoo, and there is apparently another RPG-based site that has that, ugh. I guess we're looking at a "Ghostbusters" / "Real Ghostbusters" thing now... Whatever..).

For anyone who grew playing SNES RPGs, and were a fan of them, they surely resonated to the point where they still hold office as some of your favorite games of your entire videogame life, systems, generations, and decades later. The NW Epic Center (run primarily by myself, with the aid of some special friends occasionally) will help to expose some of those games that didn't quite get the recognition they deserved, and also to relive some of the greatest games EVER as we play through them again -- together -- and open up a whole new dialogue on these lost treasures.


Next up..



Chrono Trigger is held by many (myself included) as The Greatest RPG of All Time, pun not intended. It is a benchmark title in the genre, and even after 20 years the game is discussed daily and held in high regard, even in the face of juiced-up, HD "masterpieces." Is simpler sometimes better? Sure, but we're not talking "Dragon Warrior" simple here; we're talking 16-bit perfection at its finest. I'm personally a bit worried about pursuing this game once more; it's been a long time since my last jog through it, and I'm afraid I might have the rosiest pair of glasses that any shot of nostalgia could ever produce. We find out later this month, for better or for worse. (C'mon, it's gonna be fine -- we're talking Chrono Trigger here!! THE BEST, JERRY, THE BEST!!)

Sunday, August 30th marks the start of Week 1 (if you prefer to start your own quest AFTER Sunday, like Monday, or Tuesday, or Wednesday, thats fine!). Golden Sun ran 6 Weeks. GameDadGrant will be our DUNGEON MASTER for this one, and we figure the playthrough to run about the same length. Less than two months. I'm told the total quest should last you between 20 and 30 hours.


See ya soon!!


CHRONO TRIGGER

Dungeon Master: GameDadGrant

You Did It! Chrono Trigger Complete:
VofEscaflowne
Scrawnton
Mop it up
Ludist210


Week 4 Complete:
GameDadGrant
mrbiggsly
DapperDave

Week 3 Complete:
Mr_Mustache (and Mrs_Mustache!)

Week 2 Complete:
Smerd
Dark weres
warerare
sirmastersephiroth

Week 1 Complete:
Anand

Triggermen:
HammerLord
Koovaps

Week 1
Week 2
Week 3
Week 4
Week 5

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:( :( :( :(
I can't believe it. I wanted to pace myself so I'd have "more Ogre Battle" to look forward to on any given evening, and wouldn't have to be all, "Now I have to wait 'til Sunday to continue!" But that's left me with map three to continue on Monday, or possibly Sunday evening, since my time all 'til then is booked!

@Dark Weres

Hmm? Oh, you didn't finish? Not a good plan, DW! Good luck next week.. You'll have plenty of Ogre Battle to last the week.

I didn't finish either :(

WEEK 2

-Scene 4: Advance: Pogrom Forest - Hidden Cities / Temples: 2 - Hidden Treasure: 1
-Scene 5: Full Moon: Lake Jannenia - Hidden Cities / Temples: 1 - Treasure: 1
-Scene 6: Glass Pumpkin: Deneb's Garden - Hidden Cities / Temples: 1 - Treasure: 2
-Scene 7: Days Long Gone: Slums of Zenobia - Hidden Cities / Temples: 3 - Treasure: 6

General Tips and things to remember:
-The enemy does not wait for you. They will come after you if you're paying attention or not. Use this to your advantage, and head them off.
-These Scenes are getting longer than the ones we've already done. Exhibit patience and strategy.
-Some of these Scenes can be done out of order. This is the optimum route based on levels and items available to you.
-Save your World, Sun, Judgement cards for the next few Boss fights.
-Don't forget to equip the items you find.
-Remember that the eyes of the people are always upon you..
-Not sure what else you guys are having trouble with; don't run away in Levels (aka squash enemies), rotate your guys, try to spread it out if you can (if you're seeking a righteous path).


Spoilers / handholding, of course..
Scene 4 Tips: Pogrom Forest; Undead CANNOT be killed by anything but White Magic (and another special attack we'll meet later this week). If you're rolling the Goodly Lord w/ Banish, get him in the front row. If you have another Lord (besides the one that does Poison/Phantom, like I have...grumble grumble), give him the MYSTIC so his front row attacks now have a White tint. Nice! Clerics will INSTANTLY kill Undead Characters in lieu of Healing your party UNLESS your attack is set to Strong. Befriend away when you find Neutral Characters (pretty much anywhere in the Forests, awesome not-Undead Imps are hanging out in the Mountains near Melanior); you can harness the Undead for your army as well! Again, they take NO PHYSICAL DAMAGE; keep them away from Clerics, and you are pretty much UNTOUCHABLE. Hidden cities are on the far left land mass thing at the top corners. Buried treasure N and slightly E of Melanion, and NW of Lolaima. We'll have to come back here later for some important items, but they REQUIRE a high reputation. If you have it now, you can get it; also, there are some (inconsequential) items that can ONLY be acquired with a LOW reputation.
Scene 5 Tips: Lake Jannenia; buried treasure to the NE near the mountains across the river. Octopi and be found in the Ocean along with Raven Men, and Werewolves (!!) can be found in the Mountains near the hidden Temple to the west where the road ends. Wow! You can have some of your very own Fighters be turned into Werewolves in this stage, too; Sirius is totally a werewolf himself!!! If he..are you with me?..Kills one of your Fighters in the SAME ROUND that YOU win the battle, that fighter should now be a werewolf... Much easier to recruit. And about that battle, if you fight him during the day, he'll just be a normal dude and easier to take down. I like to fight him when he's a werewolf though, like a MAN.
Scene 6 Tips: Deneb's Garden; hidden city at the end of the road inside the dark mountains. Treasure is directly West and South of it, across the mountains in those directions. Some very unique Pumpkin Men can be found in the Mountains in this stage (along with Dragons), and some generally weak long-term investment Fairies in the Forest. The Pumpkin attack was the other one I mentioned earlier; they can kill Undead characters if their attack lands -- it takes off half of the enemies HP! As we know, half of 0 is less than 1.. You are free to do as you please, but if you Forgive Deneb, you'll SEE your Reputation Meter go down. Your call! Either way, RETURN TO THIS MAP AS YOU GET STUFF THEN, ZERO. If you choose to Forgive, you can still get the best ending..but it makes it harder as your Reputation is impacted. Dig it. Also, if you Forgave her and you come back later and your Rep is in the dumper, she may just join you. Ohhh, babyyy!
Scene 7 Tips: Slums of Zenobia; lots of hidden treasure here: southish of the north mountain clump, below the walled city (use Termites to break the walls down! -- BEWARE more enemies, however...) between the road and the river, between the mountains near the bottom of the map, and the tops of the land jutting out at the top of the map. The other treasure is on one of the islands near Zenobia, the other two islands nearby have a City and a Temple (Termites are here), a 3rd Hidden City is NE from where you start, at the end of a road. Recruit Ashe and unleash him on the Boss. Lyon can be hired for 20K, or you can wait until after the stage is over to buy him for 5K. This does NOT impact your ending one way or another. After the stage is over, you can return to Kal Robst (Hidden City West of Zenobia) to get a Key to recruit a powerful character later. NO, you do not seek the throne, c'mon, mannn!


Good Luck!

So mustache. I'm at the end of scene 3 and I keep not getting canopus. I was forced to make a savestate to figure out where I went wrong. What am I doing wrong?

@viscountalpha

Click in the "OP" on "Week 1." Go down to my spoiled out "Scene 3 Tips" thing. Canopus stuff is in there. Good luck!

I still have to do scene 3 a third time to get Gilbert to join me. Wyrms why you got to play hard to get.

I finally got gilbert. Such a PITA (Pain In The..yeah) I ended up just wearing Gilbert down with Canopus by retreating each time after he struck Gilbert. This did the trick. Hopefully that helps others get him

CH3 done! Onto chapter 4!

Oh fyi mustache,I kept screwing this part up

"Revisit Latingure to hear about Yulia" That's a critical step.

@viscountalpha

Yeah, did I not put that in there? Ah well, Scene done, move on.

Ok, all done with scene 3. =U Reputation is over half, Gilbert joined me.

Took a stab at Scene 4, which is labeled above as scene 5, and made a mess of things. I was way too sloppy, and I haven't finished the map yet. I just need to go after the boss. I lost 2 of my team leaders. Can they come back? I think I'll probably start it over with a bit more care. Also, I did not get Gilbert. I'm trying to get through the maps on my own, and only using the hints to find stuff that can be gotten on a second pass of the map. Still loving my time with the game. Must suck less, though.

Finished the Forest, heading to the Lake.

@Renjaku

Wyrmfest.

@Koovaps

You can choose to go either way. You wenet to the Lake first? I've never gone their first.
There is no permadeath in this game. You can Revive them on the map at a Temple (if you wish to use them again THAT STAGE), or just finish the round. They'll be good to go next Scene. Gilbert is pretty tough, but expensive. I'm looking at my Units right now, and his Deployment rate is over 4 Grand. Yipe.

@Mr_Mustache

Yes, I went to the lake. And that's good to know about my guys. I think I'll tough it out and finish the map then. I'm hoping to not have to replay too much, though I will if need be.

@Mr_Mustache There is no permadeath for the leaders, or for anyone? I keep thinking in Fire Emblem terms of "if they die, they're gone" and getting paranoid.

Anyway I just finished the lake. The werewolf thing was pretty cool, kept me wondering what was going on.

@Koovaps

We, in theory, shouldn't have to replay ANYTHING. I 'A'd through something today though that dropped my Rep like a rock. I reset. (When Sirius says he wants to join up, uh, duh, SAY NO.)

@Zero

Anyone. Don't worry. You can buy a Revive item if you want to bring them back on the fly, you can go to a Temple and Revive them, or just end the map. Sometimes when an expensive guy dies, I just park the team for the rest of the mission. Send them back to the base so you don't have to pay for them anymore. No worries, man, you're fine.

Did you recruit any werewolves? You can get your own in the Mountains south of the Boss' place. Are you getting any other Neutral characters?


EDIT- You've completed just ONE stage for Week 2 so far, yes?

Also, for those watching the clock, Lake Jennenia took me roughly one (1) hour sans distractions. I went between Medium and Fast speeds (started Fast, fell to Medium, back to Fast when the map cleared). Ogre Battle Week 2 is halfway done for me. Army's comin' together!

@Mr_Mustache What do you mean by park them so you don't have to pay for them anymore. Are you paying each group daily or something?! I often send a bunch out and half the time they just end up sitting around, I'm probably wasting money. Though I have a ton of money so for now I'm financially ok.

And nah, didn't get me any werewolves.

@Zero

YES, you pay each group when that "ding...ding...ding" screen comes up at Noon. You'll notice that it says "Tributes" (money from Towns you've Liberated on your first/current pass -- you don't get paid upon return) and "Expenses" (your troops, and how much they cost per Unit. The Lord, alone, is 0 Goth; this is why if you do with to Return to an area that you only take your Lord, and remove the other characters from his Unit). The difference is your Profit, and thats that.

As an "adult," I've taken to send my guys back to the base when I'm done with them. I usually rotate about 3-4 Units to take on a Boss, so obviously I don't need the other 7-6 that I might have out there. Before you say "why didn't you tell me so!?," I'm certain I said something about that in the mountains upon mountains of information I've been spewing. Sorry though, if you didn't know. Are you doing alright on money? NUGGET, Scene 2 waits for you; 40,000 Goth.


--We're getting to the point where you can do some Class Changes. I think the earliest that a Fighter or an Amazon can Change Class is at Lv4, so if you see a Lv3 Wizard, he is there already because the game is friendly to you. You can always (usually) return a character to their Base (either a Fighter or an Amazon depending on gender), and Change their Class again. Sometimes you go right back to where you are, other times what you WERE before is no longer good, and you have to choose something else. If you DO want to do this, check the Charisma; if this is below 50, you won't be able to go back up.

I posted the guys we'll be seeing soon in our troops a few pages ago. FIND OUT!


EDIT- In reference to your Edited in stuff, I don't let anyone sit around unless their guarding a city. You can always be looking for Treasure or Neutral Encounters. They do not Fatigue at all (unlike Ogre Battle 64..I love that game), so get your money's worth!


EDIT2- Thought I was done for the night, but I'm apparently going right back in..right now. Deneb's Garden, here we go.

Beat Scene 4. Hate fighting undead since you typically have to hope and pray that your Cleric will actually attack. Moron will heal for no good reason at the beginning of a fight normally but when undead enemies attack the jerk takes forever.

@chrisbg99

Not so, Chris! Oh, you guys don't like to read anything, haha.

Your Cleric will INSTANTLY (not timewise, but you know what I mean) attack if your Group is set to ANYTHING but STRONG. Leader, Weak, Best; your Cleric will wipe those guys out. Watch your CHA and ALI soar.


..There really is some useful information in the Hints stuff up there........



EDIT- Scene 6 Deneb's Garden takes about an hour and a half, two hours to complete.
EDIT- My Army is really coming together. Spreading out the XP pretty good, actually benched Lans and Warren for TWO Scenes now. My promoted characters are keeping in line to reach their second tier destination. I really wish you guys would let me help you (on the topic of "Available Class Choices").

@Mr_Mustache

No I made sure to set my tactics to weak as soon as the fights started and the jerks still wouldn't attack right away.