* * * * * Chrono Trigger - Week 5 * * * * *

(Plain English: Scroll down to the bottom of the "OP" if you're lagging behind for previous weeks)


TABLE OF CONTENTS
Prologue:
i Okami Club
ii Fire Emblem Club

Epic Center:
01 Ogre Battle
24 Secret of Mana
39 Phantasy Star IV (cont'd)
67 Earthbound (cont'd)
99 Breath of Fire II (cont'd)
110 Paper Mario (cont'd)
123 Golden Sun (cont'd)
136 Chrono Trigger

(ALL VINTAGE EC GAMES ARE CONTINUED IN THEIR OFFICIAL DISCUSSION THREADS!)

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Hello, true believers! Welcome to Negative World's newest RPG-centric Club Hub, springing off the heels of the Fire Emblem Club. Way back when, Nintendo Power introduced a monthly walkthrough / in depth Role Play Game section (right around the beefiest SNES RPG era), but since they aren't around anymore to use it, Negative World will bring it out of the ashes, dust it off, and roll with it (two things of note: #1, this is not in reaction to Nintendo Force Magazine at all -- I know that because I thought of it in the shower this morning, so THERE; and #2, I just looked up "Epic Center RPG" on Yahoo, and there is apparently another RPG-based site that has that, ugh. I guess we're looking at a "Ghostbusters" / "Real Ghostbusters" thing now... Whatever..).

For anyone who grew playing SNES RPGs, and were a fan of them, they surely resonated to the point where they still hold office as some of your favorite games of your entire videogame life, systems, generations, and decades later. The NW Epic Center (run primarily by myself, with the aid of some special friends occasionally) will help to expose some of those games that didn't quite get the recognition they deserved, and also to relive some of the greatest games EVER as we play through them again -- together -- and open up a whole new dialogue on these lost treasures.


Next up..



Chrono Trigger is held by many (myself included) as The Greatest RPG of All Time, pun not intended. It is a benchmark title in the genre, and even after 20 years the game is discussed daily and held in high regard, even in the face of juiced-up, HD "masterpieces." Is simpler sometimes better? Sure, but we're not talking "Dragon Warrior" simple here; we're talking 16-bit perfection at its finest. I'm personally a bit worried about pursuing this game once more; it's been a long time since my last jog through it, and I'm afraid I might have the rosiest pair of glasses that any shot of nostalgia could ever produce. We find out later this month, for better or for worse. (C'mon, it's gonna be fine -- we're talking Chrono Trigger here!! THE BEST, JERRY, THE BEST!!)

Sunday, August 30th marks the start of Week 1 (if you prefer to start your own quest AFTER Sunday, like Monday, or Tuesday, or Wednesday, thats fine!). Golden Sun ran 6 Weeks. GameDadGrant will be our DUNGEON MASTER for this one, and we figure the playthrough to run about the same length. Less than two months. I'm told the total quest should last you between 20 and 30 hours.


See ya soon!!


CHRONO TRIGGER

Dungeon Master: GameDadGrant

You Did It! Chrono Trigger Complete:
VofEscaflowne
Scrawnton
Mop it up
Ludist210


Week 4 Complete:
GameDadGrant
mrbiggsly
DapperDave

Week 3 Complete:
Mr_Mustache (and Mrs_Mustache!)

Week 2 Complete:
Smerd
Dark weres
warerare
sirmastersephiroth

Week 1 Complete:
Anand

Triggermen:
HammerLord
Koovaps

Week 1
Week 2
Week 3
Week 4
Week 5

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URL to share (right click and copy)

@PogueSquadron

Why announce that!? It only angers the Stache. Just pretend you're not!

WEEK 1 - DISCOVER THE SECRET!!

Man, I'm stoked.. (and we're going a little more "general" / bulletpoint as Okami Club was..)

-Start your game! Get the Sword, do your Potos thang, and move on!
-Work your way through Gaia's Navel and into the Dwarf's Village
-Use your new Axe to work through the Haunted Forest to defeat the Witch
-Get your first spell from Undine (huzzah!), and work your way into the Underground Palace.
-At the end of this thing, you may just find yourself with ANOTHER Magic power.


And that is the WHOLE week. I swear it looks like 40 minutes (but it isn't..probably closer to 3 hours even.).


(Please) Try not to play ahead, but feel free to griiiiiiind all you want. WOO!



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EDITED IN



Like Ogre Battle, Secret of Mana was another game that I couldn't get enough of in my youth, and it also changed the way I thought about Role Playing Games. I grew up used to Dragon Warrior and Final Fantasy, two huge-time RPGs that made their money on turn-based affair. Secret of Mana set itself apart from games of that ilk, however, while still nesting in in the RPG genre. It was known as an "Action RPG," allowing the player to move freely and attack at will while still enjoying the experience points and magic-y goodness that we've come to love. Was it the first of its kind? More than likely not, but it FEEEELS like it in my heart.

This game has been mentioned A LOT in the last year, as a number of our members have been meaning to get around to playing it, but just haven't found the means to. And here we are: Negative World Epic Center presents Secret of Mana. In our database (at press time), Secret of Mana enjoys a 9.23 average, wtih 29 Ratings and 7 Perfect 10s. Will we add a few more to this list? Quite possibly. This game has a widespread love, and has been made available on many other platforms, but was born on the SNES. Members are encouraged to join up and play on any console you deem worthy, though SNES / Wii VC is of course, preferred.


We pack up at the end of this week and head out into the wilderness at midnight (Saturday Night..) on Sunday, March 10th (if you prefer to start your own quest AFTER Sunday, like Monday, or Tuesday, or Wed-- you get the picture; thats fine!). There will be a number of checkpoints per week, and looking at a quick bullet list, this looks to be the least intensive quest we've had yet. I know I keep saying that, haha, but we should be able to cruise through this thing with no problem in roughly 6 weeks. If Week 1 is too heavy, we can scale back and move this to a 7 week program, and of course an 8th week if we need it. I really don't think we will.


A little more info on Secret of Mana. Unlike typical RPGs before it, this one granted players the ability to play with a friend...AND ANOTHER FRIEND. Yes, using the SNES Multi-Tap, THREE(3) players could team up and hit the ground running with swords/spears/axes a blazing. Without spoiling the game too much, each character has their own abilities, with the two "support" characters being polar opposites of each other in a sense. This game also boasts some of the best music heard in any game ever, and it still holds up today. The story was enough for a kid, but word has it that it may've worn a little thin with the years, haha. I'm eager to see how I take it as an "adult."

We'll talk more about this as we go on, of course, the first week will go up on Saturday, and you can play all day Sunday, or sprinkle it out throughout your week. It'll be SWEET!




SECRET OF MANA
Mr_Mustache / Mrs_Mustache
VickiL
DarkWeres
Cube191
Ludist210
PogueSquadron
DrFinkelstein
ShadowLink
Jew Drop

Mr_Mustache said:

I like Dr. Pepper!

This is NOT a ringing endorsement. Dr Pepper sucks.


But for now Mana Time! Someone come chat as I play.

@DrFinkelstein Because I wanted to shout it from the moutaintops, haha. Anywho, just know that I'm playing at the same parts you all are at and will never discuss anything beyond that.


Regarding the first chunk of this game so far - the music disguises so many flaws for me. It's so goddamn good. I'm never really thinking about how incredibly generic the premise seems at this day and age, but all I think about is my childhood. Playing this game on my aunt's couch, while we all talked about how the Mode 7 visuals reminded us of the local news' Doppler Radar. Good times.

I've also named my character Kit, as I always do.

It's very basic, haha. But when I was a kid, it was epic as hell. And the ruins/people in masks really used to freak me out to the point where I didn't even want to play the game. What creepy music that was.

This game's writing is way, way worse than I remember:
"Dwarves live in that cave. They make good weapons and know all about weapons." Nice translation, haha. Yikes!

Still, it's a fun game, albeit just as clunky as I remember. It's really annoying when you try to hit an enemy and you're just not lined up right, or they haven't fully recovered out of an animation or something. Usually you can queue up an attack when they're resting, but you can get caught in some weird timing. My ally already got herself stuck on rocks twice, I was hit by a mushroom I couldn't see behind a tree, and only got out of the forest because I've played this game before and always keep healing items with me. I don't know why this game's flaws make it charming to me though. I guess it's nostalgia...and that music. Man, that music. (Also, I don't mean that it's a flaw that you need healing item, but it's surprisingly easy to get yourself killed in this game early on...I had a hell of a time with it when I was younger)

So yeah. Always have candies with you at the beginning. Don't be shy about using them because you never know if you'll get caught up in a string of bad attacks or get poisoned out of nowhere. The beginning of the game has a knack for poisoning you with the Mushbooms and stuff.

I'd also recommend that you don't worry about equipping the girl up right away. You'll find out why, but it's not something you need to waste money on. I wasted money on a Cup of Wishes, which sucked because they were expensive, but I'm kind of glad I did because I almost died soon after.

I forget - when you die, do you go back to your most recent save point? Do you hold onto any of your experience you gained before death?

I'm maybe somewhere between an hour, hour and a half in, and am at the Dwarf Village. Fun music.

Ahhh, this music is heavenly! The people of Potos, however, are not! One day I shall return and burn your damn village to the ground! Talk about selfish, little cowards!

Made it to Pandora before I had to go to bed.

Oops, I meant to say I wouldn't buy equipment for the girl right away. I always give her the spear at the beginning. I might play with giving her a new weapon this time around though.

Booting up....

Ah, a classic scrolling tiled background of the 16-bit era! I'm torn between calling him Steve or Randi. I guess I'll go with... Randi. First time playing and all. I want to see it as it is meant to be!

The story so far is incredibly basic, but hell, what do we expect from a game this old which also wasn't designed with super adult themes in mind? The main characters are children.

I don't understand this whole percentage thing though... someone care to explain? Also, man that pause menu is unclear no?

My sword leveled up before I left the forest. That was coooool.

God I feel like such a n00b. Has everyone else played this before except for me?

Update: So I made it to the town after the palace. And I'm still not understanding some mechanics. How charging helps...how much it actually helps... how do I eat my candy? I almost did at the start when I didn't need to, and now I can't when I do need to. Stopped for now.

@DrFinkelstein Yeah, think of the percentage as your stamina. When it's 100%, you'll get your full attack. However, sometimes attacking before it hits 100% can be helpful, such as when you want to knock an enemy on their back to daze them while you can catch your breath. Also, you can only sprint when you're at 100% (with the A button).

Charging up can be helpful IMO when you're fighting a large group of enemies, especially when you're grinding. There's a bit of risk/reward to it though, as charging will leave you open to enemy attack.

The Ring menu is more confusing than I remember. What you have to remember is that your WEAPONS have their own ring on the main ring menu. If you want to equip anything else (armor, headgear, etc), you have to go into the Equip submenu. It seems a bit wonky, but it's still kind of a novel way of letting you access things quickly.

The ring menu will also let you map out your actions for your AI characters. You can decide if you want them to hang back, or if you want them up in an enemy's grill. For instance, if you have a long range weapon, you could maybe put that on one of your characters and make sure that they don't approach enemies on their own.

Get used to your weapons leveling up...a LOT haha. If you ever wanted to (not that I think it's very helpful), you could equip a different weapon and level THAT up. This could be helpful for the other characters, but I personally just have them focus on one weapon throughout the game. Over the course of the game, your partner characters will likely be using their weapons less and less anyway.

Played a little more tonight. I accidentally found myself in a town not even in your week one descriptions... so I went back for fear of losing progress, but when I made it back into Pandora's Castle, I found myself at level 5. So I hope I did a little accidental grinding.

Well...it's taken me about two and a half hours to get to the middle part of bullet four, with only about 10 minutes of grinding at the very start of the game. I am dying a lot, so I think I'll pause to grind now. Should I include that in my time estimate? If it's required to survive?

@VickiL

We should be tracking our time playing? I haven't been. Though Nintendo does that on the machine right?

I don't think we need to track it. I just knew I was sitting down to play for a huge chunk of time, and knew Mr. Mustache asked for the timing when someone finished up. I kinda thought I'd get through it, given the "40 minute" estimate, but that didn't pan out.

I was playing lots because I don't have much game time Monday through Friday most weeks. My weekends tend to be 40% chores, 40% gaming, and 20% sleep.

@Mr_Mustache I think Counter is the number of times you've saved.

I didn't used to die so much in this game...but I used to spend more time grinding, so there you go. People didn't start dying until my minions showed up; seems the only person who stays alive is the one I'm controlling.