* * * * * Chrono Trigger - Week 5 * * * * *

(Plain English: Scroll down to the bottom of the "OP" if you're lagging behind for previous weeks)


TABLE OF CONTENTS
Prologue:
i Okami Club
ii Fire Emblem Club

Epic Center:
01 Ogre Battle
24 Secret of Mana
39 Phantasy Star IV (cont'd)
67 Earthbound (cont'd)
99 Breath of Fire II (cont'd)
110 Paper Mario (cont'd)
123 Golden Sun (cont'd)
136 Chrono Trigger

(ALL VINTAGE EC GAMES ARE CONTINUED IN THEIR OFFICIAL DISCUSSION THREADS!)

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *


Hello, true believers! Welcome to Negative World's newest RPG-centric Club Hub, springing off the heels of the Fire Emblem Club. Way back when, Nintendo Power introduced a monthly walkthrough / in depth Role Play Game section (right around the beefiest SNES RPG era), but since they aren't around anymore to use it, Negative World will bring it out of the ashes, dust it off, and roll with it (two things of note: #1, this is not in reaction to Nintendo Force Magazine at all -- I know that because I thought of it in the shower this morning, so THERE; and #2, I just looked up "Epic Center RPG" on Yahoo, and there is apparently another RPG-based site that has that, ugh. I guess we're looking at a "Ghostbusters" / "Real Ghostbusters" thing now... Whatever..).

For anyone who grew playing SNES RPGs, and were a fan of them, they surely resonated to the point where they still hold office as some of your favorite games of your entire videogame life, systems, generations, and decades later. The NW Epic Center (run primarily by myself, with the aid of some special friends occasionally) will help to expose some of those games that didn't quite get the recognition they deserved, and also to relive some of the greatest games EVER as we play through them again -- together -- and open up a whole new dialogue on these lost treasures.


Next up..



Chrono Trigger is held by many (myself included) as The Greatest RPG of All Time, pun not intended. It is a benchmark title in the genre, and even after 20 years the game is discussed daily and held in high regard, even in the face of juiced-up, HD "masterpieces." Is simpler sometimes better? Sure, but we're not talking "Dragon Warrior" simple here; we're talking 16-bit perfection at its finest. I'm personally a bit worried about pursuing this game once more; it's been a long time since my last jog through it, and I'm afraid I might have the rosiest pair of glasses that any shot of nostalgia could ever produce. We find out later this month, for better or for worse. (C'mon, it's gonna be fine -- we're talking Chrono Trigger here!! THE BEST, JERRY, THE BEST!!)

Sunday, August 30th marks the start of Week 1 (if you prefer to start your own quest AFTER Sunday, like Monday, or Tuesday, or Wednesday, thats fine!). Golden Sun ran 6 Weeks. GameDadGrant will be our DUNGEON MASTER for this one, and we figure the playthrough to run about the same length. Less than two months. I'm told the total quest should last you between 20 and 30 hours.


See ya soon!!


CHRONO TRIGGER

Dungeon Master: GameDadGrant

You Did It! Chrono Trigger Complete:
VofEscaflowne
Scrawnton
Mop it up
Ludist210


Week 4 Complete:
GameDadGrant
mrbiggsly
DapperDave

Week 3 Complete:
Mr_Mustache (and Mrs_Mustache!)

Week 2 Complete:
Smerd
Dark weres
warerare
sirmastersephiroth

Week 1 Complete:
Anand

Triggermen:
HammerLord
Koovaps

Week 1
Week 2
Week 3
Week 4
Week 5

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URL to share (right click and copy)

WEEK 4 - Memories


-4.1 With Spar leading the charge (he can walk through trees!), head through the Big Sea of Trees to The Great Wise Tree.
-He's lost his memory, and will need help from an Item in Tunlan..but you can't understand them, so you'll need another Item. Woo, Fetch Quest (Week)!! Directions to Highfort below, or you can ride grampa all over the place looking.
-Your trials at Highfort should yield a Famous Flute, and you can return to Tunlan.
-4.2 You'll need to talk to the Queen of Tunlan..but she's sick, and only one guy can help her. Oh no..
-Return with Gedd who left something on Mt. Maori. Bring Sten, get what you need, and return for your next goal.
-Secure the Area -- in the Queen. Check your inventory screen in each room and see what that little monster guy is doing up there. You want him sleepin', brah! Fight in each area until he is.
-4.3With the Therapy Pillow, return to The Great Wise Tree..and enter his MIND, MANNN! (IMPORTANT STUFF BELOW ABOUT HOUSE #4 TENANT, MAKE SURE YOU'VE GOT YOUR OTHER 3 HOUSES FILLED AND YOUR TOWN IS READY BEFORE THIS.)
-Once you clear the very confusing "dungeon" portion (and Exit w/ Spar), talk to a kid in Inheart (young) who asks if you'd like to leave Gandaroof's mind. And you do (MAKE SURE YOU GOT WHAT YOU WANTED, YOU WON'T BE BACK!)
-That's the end of the week, but we'll trigger the first part of next week right now before returning to TownShip. Head south (from the Great Tree, and past a bridge) to Fog Valley. It is impossible to cross in its current state, and we'll begin working towards that resoltion on Sunday.

As always, just hang out at TownShip when you're done. Level up, fish it up, whatevs.


More: 4.1, Alright, depending on where you're coming from, two different ways to get to our next goal. We want to be going to The Great Wise Tree in the Big Sea of Trees, west of Tunlan. If you're in Tunlan, easy to get there, but if you finished last week on time, you're probably back in TownShip. Sooo..find your way to the Big Sea of Trees, West of Tunlan. If you haven't been back to TownShip, Spar has a pretty awesome Uniting with Seso, very powerful, and changes his appearance. Wow! Afterwards, you can Warp to Tunlan w/ Jean, switch out your party in town, and then take Grampa west. 4.1 Easiest way to Highfort is to go from south from TownShip (bring Jean and Sten), and get out near the house. Use Jean to become a HUGE FROG, up the Cliffs, and into a castle town. 4.1 Highfort, as Sten, LOTS of treasure chests to find. If you don't being thorough through here can be quite rewarding! 4.2, be sure to bring a girl (Seso bonded Spar counts!) on this leg (Mt. Maori, NE of Tunlan / N of HomeTown), and there is a great place to gain some levels for your lower ranked characters, too. 4.2 Mt. Maori part 2, lots of chests to get here, too, and you gotta get a Mushroom as well. The correct one is the rightmost / lowests one on the little island you gotta 'Sten' over to. 4.3, you can NOT return to this place (Dream/InHeart/Memory) after clearing the area. The consensus best House #4 Tenant resides here, Barose. He will teach your party spells..if you give him a place to stay. More on that later, if you want him. If you don't, or miss him, either way, you won't be able to ge thim later. He is named Barose, and located in the Inn in the young version of Inheart. 4.3 Memory, from the walkthrough I'm pulling from: From the 1st floor, talk with the old man nearby if you want, but head north (feel your way up) and talk to the old man up there. He'll offer to escort you to the "entrance" for 100 coins. Don't say no to him, or else he'll charge 1000 coins next time you ask. Say yes, and you'll still be in the same room, but in the center. Now, see those two chests directly north of you? If you want them, you have to talk to the old man again and say yes when he asks you if he can escort you to the "exit." Now you'll appear next to those two chests; feel free to open them. Don't talk to the old man until you get the chests, or you won't have a chance to open them since he'll send you outside of Memory. So there's that. There are other chests to get in here, too; one on the 3rd floor, and another three on the 5th.


Not sure how long this thing is. Getting a late start here, but it appears that only two of us were ready for it. Ah boy.
Merry Christmas, friends! Good luck out there (on all fronts)! And drive carefully!

Done with Leg 1. Took a bit. I was taking my time though. I'm about halfway through Leg 2, did both while watching the MNF game, fast forwarding through commercials.

Without your directions, I would be so lost. This is the worst part about the game. I wish the map at least showed the town names somehow. UGH.

And that Highfort fight alone with the monkey is ridiculous. Lost half my cash because I wasn't expecting a boss fight right there and then.

UGH.

Watched Lou play this game for a few minutes the other day. He was not amused.

Personally, I still think the BoF series is great!! BoF3 is my favorite.... never played 2 or 5.

Amusement Level: 0

I'm ready for the next Xenoblade, which I consider the pinnacle of RPGs.

@TheOldManFromZelda
@NinSage

I'm not sure how much is "you" and how much is "the game." Joe, whats the word?

Like I told Lou the other day, "I figured it out as a kid;" maybe we're just more patient then and don't mind searching? I don't know. I know Lou told me how he figured out Milon's Secret Castle on his own. I have no freakin' idea HOW. Kid Stuff!

EDIT- I've thought about it before, just how well we'd handle a *NEW* NES Zelda with NO direction whatsoever. Come to think of it, I'm not entirely sure if I ever completed the 2nd Quest fully. I must've somewhere in there, with guidance. Have I? Hmm....

@Mr_Mustache

Those games were much smaller in scale though, with no NPCs and no extra characters besides the main character you controlled. The world/castle was also much smaller, and didn't take long to walk around. Not a good comparison.

And the second quest in Zelda was great. So difficult!

Made it up to the Witch's Tower, but bailed before I finished because I was getting too low on herbs. Is the nearest town seriously Captain?

@TheOldManFromZelda

I dunno, Milon's Secret Castle had seven spots where you had to jump in very specific places...I only figured that game out as a kid because of Nintendo Power. Seriously, that game was very obscure.

@TheOldManFromZelda

You know, I don't think I've beaten it. Definitely not on my own. I was doing one of the NES Remix stages, and they have a part where you gotta walk through a wall. WHAT. I can't check every wall! I liked bombing the S out of 'em though later in the game, though I'm not sure if its' better or worse when they start working on almost every try.

And Milon..I watched something for AVGN, and he mentioned how there were something like 1000 blocks in there. Thats A TON.

@ludist210

Per Chat, yes, I believe that is your current closest place. If you have Gold (the lure), you can fish out Maniro over by the Wild Cat Restaurant (in your area, up and left from the Campsite), and there is some equipment that you can buy there. Not sure how much it'll run you, but I'd bring 12,000. (I'D bring that, you might be ok with 8K?) That should give you a good boost for the Tower, and set you up for a bit.

How is your Tenant situation? Did you get the guys w/ Equpiment, like Hekkeler or Lemington (I passed up Lem in favor of the Fishing Spot Guy)? I feel like a lot of issues you guys are having might be related to being..underequipped.. ie: perhaps if you had better Armor you'd take less damage and use less Herbs? Furthermore, if you had better weapons you'd be beating guys sooner and allowing them less attacks. Your levels sounded OK to me, I think. I can't remember what the suggested level was. I know I'm always above it; I was fighting S.Idols forEVER looking for a StoneAR for Rand. Never found it; just awful.

@Mr_Mustache

Eh, made it through on the second try with no problems...except the Witch's sleep spells are super effective! Knocked everyone in my party out cold (except for Rand, thank goodness) for the duration of the fight. Rand's Wake didn't work either, so it's only because Sten died mid-fight (and I revived him with a potion) that anyone else woke up. I managed to win with everyone alive (barely) and only two active party members. I got back to the campsite south of the tower, swapped out Sten for Katt, and now I'm off to help Jean.

EDIT: And I got the Shaman in the tower.

@ludist210

Seso yields a Wisdom bonus when bonded, so a Magic user like Nina or Rand even will benefit most. Remember that bonded folks sitting back at your ranch do NOTHING for you.

And I've just remembered that you've played through this game before. I'll leave this here for others who haven't..

Alright, just wrapped up my Week 4 while watching a freshly bought VHS copy of Royal Rumble 1993. AWESOME.

Little help: bring your weakest guys (probably..) to the Queen. Fire Weapons seem to do massive damage in there, too. The "Fatty" enemies are VERY resilient though, and hit like a dumptruck. Beware.

When you acquire the Therapy Pillow, if you wish to buy some EXPENSIVE weapons and armor after that point, you'll want to bring between 15-25K with you. Legit. I think I spent about 22, and that was after selling some Roasts off that I carried with me. There are the best (so far) weapons for Spar and Sten available, as well as some strong Armor for Ryu, Jean, and some others. I used one for Bow, too, but even though Sten can use it, I treat he and Katt similarly as my Vigor champs. Going first is pretty important, wouldn't you say? The Armor would drop his Vigor quite a bit, not such a big deal for Bow, and depending on how you play, Ryu either.

Those S.Idols before (a few weeks ago), looking for a StoneAR for Rand (which is one of 3 armors he can equip the entire game), forget about those guys and work on the Ganga (they look like S.Idols, but are gold) in Mt. Maori. (Apparently, they have a higher drop rate than the S.Idols) I hung out in that "dragon pool" room right near the entrance, and just kept refreshing myself. I spent about 15-20 minutes fighting fight after fight (after finishing Week 4), and I equipped a Collar on Bow (to increase enemy encounter rate). I saw probably 6 or so fights with Ganga in them, and the final one yielded that armor. It's about 20 points stronger, but drops your Vigor to 0. If you don't going last every round..its pretty good.

I guess thats it. Anyone else struggling with anything? What happened to our Week 2 people? Has no one but Lou (and Ludist) voyaged into/beyond Week 3? Eek.

I'll get Week 5 up on Sunday between "watching football" and "breaking out in cold sweats over Fantasy scores."

WEEK 5 - No Expenses Spared

Yes, bring your wallet this week..

-5.1 Alright, so you inspected Fog Valley at the end of last week, and you're either behind and coming straight from there, or on time and coming from somewhere like TownShip. Cool! In any event, you're looking for SkyTower, which sits in the ocean and takes up one square. If you have trouble finding it, you can take Grampa directly down from Capitan's beach, or just search above Tunlan.
-Clear the Sky Tower, and find out just what the deal is! (Help below)
-Surprise! It was another Shaman. Return to TownShip, see what she can do (and did you get Barose? More help below on both..). Head to Fog Valley afterwards and pass through as you couldn't before. Swing by another Great Tree nearby for some helpful info you don't need (which, if you're Lou, would fill in one of those "if you didn't tell me where to go, I wouldn't know what to do" deals), or proceed to Farm Town.

-5.2 These people look like someone you know -- it's Rand! Talk to the people with him, and do your chores!
-The next morning, you'll head west to Namanda per Rand's Mom. Bring 2000 bucks for something awesome LATER in the game (more below).
-Are your guys under Lv30? Probably. Head to Guntz (south of Tunlan) to purchase some equipment, and then some other optional-but-you-should-probably-do-this stuff. (More below.) When you're all set there, return to Farm Town.
-It appears that Rand's Mom has had a sudden change of heart (perhaps a little TOO sudden..), and she has gone to the Great Church. BUT FIRST, more sidequests!
-Sidequests return to Namanda, try to play the song in place of the other guy. Drum/Gong is A, HighNote/TuningFork is B. If successful, you get Boombada, a spell which halves an enemies HP. Eep! House 5 + 6 Hanz (HomeTown, inside the house next to Ryu/Bow's) and Daiye (2nd Floor, Windia Inn) are the consensus best tentants for these houses. TownShip Inside the Well; nothing to do down here, but you're triggering something ("inspect" the room?). More below.

-5.3Eichichi will tell you where to go next, and we're off to Windia!
-With Nina in the lead, talk to the guard (make sure you have some Smoke items). Some things are revealed, and a new area opens up here. It is your destiny.
-In SkyTower, with Nina, there are some opportunities for treasure chests, but patience is required, of course! Use Smoke to cut down on battles here. Do what you gotta do, and get PUMPED for a Ceremony.
-THE GREAT BIRD IS UNLEASHED. You're supposed to fly to the Great Church now, but simply land and return to Windia, collect some other treasures, and call it a week.


Was that long? Didn't LOOK long, but FELT long. Two hours of typing? TRASH.


More: 5.1, Expensive equipment here, as well as a chance to pick up a great sword for free. On your way there, you'll notice that you have a timer when underwater (not sure why that thing from SimaFort doesn't work..), and you WILL die if it runs out. It is suggested that you use Ryu's Smoke spell, or a Smoke item to cut down on enemy encouters, as your clock will run while fighting them, too. When you get to a room where you can buy equipment, going east will send you towards that sword and other chests (but you gotta double back and come the way you came, so plan your trip accordingly). West from that room will take you deeper. There are other chests to find in this dungeon, to take a look around! 5.1 post-SkyTowerYES, a new Shaman. She is the Wind Shaman, and can make some new combinations. Still nothing for Katt, but we've got a Green option for Nina, and most notably a "Class Change" type deal for Sten. You'll barely recognize him! The same things that a Seso-Bonded Spar benefited from (including an AP boost) are now for Sten with Sana-Spoor (TWO SHAMANS AT ONCE). And yes, you can keep both at the same time out there. NASTY!
5.1 Barose (you don't HAVE to do this right now), Ok, this guy will teach you spells. He's a helper though, and likes it if you're a) low on AP and b) low on HP. Easiest ways are to run yourself completely dry on spells (cast spells and work it out so you end with 0) and either kill someone off in battle and then change them at a Dragon Shrine, -or- consume Bait (which will drop you right to HP1). With that out of the way, he'll teach you a Spell 4 times (4 people x1, 2 people x2, 1 person x4, or a mixture). The options are Thunder, Freeze, Flame, Missile, with Missile being the best, by far. You've probably seen some of these other spells in action, so you know what they can do. These spells WILL be learned naturally by some of your players, but some of them (specifically Missile) are way late in the game, so it's up to you. Your best bets for learning are Nina, Spar, or Bow. Ok choices are Jean, Sten, or Rand. Ryu and Katt are terrible choices as Ryu has Real Ultimate Dragon Power, and Katt has like no AP. Looking at this chart here, vs. who will learn stuff naturally, I'm PROBABLY going to give Missile to Spar, Jean, Rand, and Bow. None of those guys learn it naturally. (Nina at 57, Sten at 38..) The choice is yours, and you can go with any of the other ones, too! SO, now that you've figured it out, and you've got a 0AP, 1HP person, just keep talking to Barose with that person until he offers to teach you the spell you want. As you talk to him (with that person), his mood will change. Basically, the lighter his dragon meter gets (moving towards Rainbow), the better the spell gets. When he offers you one you want, tell him YES! Anything else, tell him NO!, and just talk to him again. Remember, Missile is the best one (in terms of damage and quality), and he'll offer it to you at Rainbow. (If you talk to him with someone else, his mood will drop.) Any questions?
5.2, Cash money, in Namanda, you can donate to..Namanda, the God of Harvest and Crops. 100 bucks will advance your game..but if you donate TWENTY (20) times for a total of 2000 bucks, you'll be able to get the Earth Shaman down the line a bit. 5.2 post-Namanda, we've got you going to Guntz for some equipment, and then off to look for Monster Island. There is a small one with a hut on it, due south of Guntz after a larger island. On the island, Bow's Shot ability will wipe some enemies out in one shot. It is suggested that you build your guys to up around Lv30 on this island. Good luck. (And if you're bringing Bow, did you find a Collar anywhere? If you're just building levels looking for fights, good time to use it..)
5.2 Sidequests you can get whoever you'd like for Houses 5 and 6, but these are the best options. If you aren't interested in those Etc. type Items (which are important for cooking) and a guy who sells you fish (which are important for cooking), feel free to pick up whoever you'd like in your travels..though they probably won't be helpful. After inspecting the Well in TownShip, Exit the Well, add Spar, warp to Guntz, talk to the nearby Wise Tree, learn about Eichichi, and return to Guntz. Inspect the Northern building, go behind the Easternmost bookcase, down a secret ladder! Tell Eichichi what you want, and if you triggered that deal earlier, all systems should be go, and she'll head there herself.


I'll get going on this "soon" (probably tonight), and I'll chime in with some more stuff. Good luck out there!

I'm soooooo far behind

Each week is taking roughly 6-8 hours. YUCK.

Cleared week 4, minus triggering the fog thing. I have myself and Katt already above Level 30. Eesh. Also, the dream tree sequence has AWFUL enemies. Double thunder almost every turn against me. The boss was cake compared to that slog.

@DapperDave

Pshyeah ya are!

@TheOldManFromZelda

I don't think they're taking me that long.. Hmm. Are you doing anything extra? Dying a lot? I don't think I had any trouble in the tree stuff, hmm. Who did you bring besides you and Spar? I think my guys are 25-29.

And thats fine about The Fog, just start with that next time.

I'm not doing anything extra. Just sooooo many random battles. I took Jean with me on this quest, not sure why. It helped him level up past level 20, though.

Man, catching Bait was a BEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE. (Missile learned x4, as planned.)

5.1 complete.

@TheOldManFromZelda

Leave Jean at home for 5.1 For some reason, he was taking HUMUNGOUS damage.

And I spent about 40k in 5.1 Not sure how much you want to do. Make sure you get the GoblinSD.