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GamerGate Explained!!! [locked]
 
It's this thing on the Internet.

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09/13/14, 05:42    Locked 01/04/16, 01:39
 
   
 
@DapperDave In most cases, starts with racist or sexist parents. Add in structural racism and sexism. Media is probably an influence (don't say that in front of some people though.)

Some people just seem wired towards relying on anecdotal evidence that confirms negative bias though. Hard to say why. There's lots of research on why but it ends up pretty divided. Tribal roots and all that. Back when it was evolutionary sound to see "different" as "threat"? I think some of that stuff is bunk though. Science always struggles to understand racism.

@J.K. Riki I feel like I have enough of a sense of the people involved here that I know that linking to Deep Freeze probably isn't going to convert anyone to Gamergate thinking. I actually feel like seeing Deep Freeze is one of the best arguments against Gamergate so... yeah. Mostly I think the only people buying into Deep Freeze are the ones who were already Gamergate supporters.
11/10/15, 23:13   
Edited: 11/10/15, 23:26
@DapperDave

No, you don't get to keep asking more questions.

@Shadowlink

Eh, let's wait until you can post a video you can see. I'm not sure it's the right one. Kinda looks like it could be truncated. I don't understand it.
11/10/15, 23:14   
@Guillaume

Dammit. Stupid work filters. Google description seemed right.

It'll have to wait until I get home.
11/10/15, 23:17   
@Zero

You think Mustache's posts you consider sexist will convert people here then? That they are immune to you linking to sexist, racist things in one place, but not if it's in some thread here. That that perpetuates sexism, but you linking directly to reams upon reams of sexist, racist things is A-OK.

EDIT: I hope at least you can see why I'm confused and this seems super duper double standard or something.
11/10/15, 23:20   
Edited: 11/10/15, 23:20
Shadowlink said:

The fact that the people in the ad were West Indian and not Afrrican American didn't matter. The fact that the point of the ad was simply about a nice gesture between opposing fans was lost. Suddenly the narrative was an arrogant whitey placating angry black people with a sterotypical meal of fried chicken. Because a bunch of Americans came in and imposed *their* standards and interpretations on an ad that had nothing to do with them, and was never aimed at their market.

That's a really interesting ad. As an American, it sets off all kinds of racist alarm bells for me. But it's possible that the makers were completely oblivious. In fact the ad comes across as so racist that I can't imagine why they would purposefully do that. They must have been clueless.


I think I'd answer your questions with a question, can something be racist if there was no racist intent? Some would argue yes.
11/10/15, 23:23   
Guillaume said:
@DapperDave

No, you don't get to keep asking more questions.
.

Yes I do. You don't have to answer. I'll miss your contributions.
11/10/15, 23:24   
Edited: 11/10/15, 23:28
No I don't think Mustache's posts I consider sexist will convert anyone. Did I ever say I thought they would? I don't think there is much of a chance of that happening.

I do think they're insulting though, especially to our female members, and not something I want on this site.

Linking to a messy site to use it as a negative example isn't really the same thing at all. And I wouldn't even call Deep Freeze bigoted, I'd just say what I've been saying... it's a site that demonstrates a severe lack of understanding of what ethics in games journalism is / should be.

Does that help explain why this is definitely not a double standard? If not, please explain what exactly you think the double standard is, because I'm seriously confused why you think the two things are even remotely related.
11/10/15, 23:25   
Edited: 11/10/15, 23:28
You know what? I don't like myself for doing this. I don't like myself for doing what I used to do, and weaving this beautiful tapestry of garbage logic to try and call you out on things I think are a mistake. So I will PM you my response and not post it here, and then I will stop this stupid, unloving behavior because the little Jargon voice in my head is currently saying "What about that PM you sent me?" And little Jargon voice is right in this instance.
11/10/15, 23:35   
@J.K. Riki

'little Jargon voice'?

That sounds terrifying
11/10/15, 23:37   
We all have a little Jargon voice inside of us.
11/10/15, 23:41   
@Shadowlink

It is normally, I would wager, but in this case that voice is helping me, lol.

Also... saying to... burn things...
Weird...

11/10/15, 23:46   
Hey, a little Jargon telling us to be understanding is a good thing. I've got my own although sometimes it gets over powered by Nograj, purveyor of snark and scorn.
11/11/15, 03:54   
Edited: 11/11/15, 03:56
@Jargon

If I ever write a fantasy novel, the main villain will totally be named Nograj. Fits perfectly.
11/11/15, 04:24   
@Guillaume



Hmm. The one I got from google appears to have been used as a clip in some talk show...but I can't find a longer version. I thought there was a longer version with a bit more context (like a good play on field by the Windies team, thus resulting in the fan celebration/Aussie disappointment), but maybe I'm wrong. It was a long time ago. I guess this is basically all we have to go on.

@DapperDave

It's hard to say. I would argue in this case that the intended context counts for a lot. For example if it was an American advertising exec behind this, and it was airing in an American market (and I guess with American fans in the ad), you could make a good case that even with the shield of ignorance, it might still be considered racist. But when you're dealing with a context so far removed from the one it's being judged by, I think it's harder to make the racist label stick.
11/11/15, 09:05   
Edited: 11/11/15, 09:06
@Shadowlink

Ah, weird. Yeah, without more context, it's a really weird ad and it's easy to find racism in it. One white dude not enjoying himself surrounded by black people having a good time and paying no attention to him. Why exactly does he need to placate them? Haha.
11/11/15, 16:03   
Why do you think the commercial being discussed removed some of the content that adds more context?
11/11/15, 18:22   
Well it seems it's tied to an important sports event, the simplest explanation is the longer version was run during the event and a shortened version was shown subsequently. This happens all the time with Superbowl ads.
11/11/15, 18:40   
Even if you put aside the black people love fried chicken aspect, it's not clear why being in a group of people having fun at the game is an "awkward situation."
11/11/15, 19:06   
@Jargon

West Indies fans are apparently known to be rowdy.



The ad does a very poor job of illustrating that, if that was their aim.
11/11/15, 19:15   
@Guillaume

I think their aim, and I'm just thinking out loud based on my background in marketing, was to sell chicken.
11/11/15, 19:26   
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