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So, why don't Nintendo fans like fighting games? [roundtable]
 
I've come to the realization that fighting games fans don't play Nintendo systems. I'm not sure why, but they don't. And the Nintendo fans that do own Nintendo hardware, don't care for the genre. Unless it's Smash Bros. of course, where Nintendo nostalgia and fan-service figuratively burst from the screen. That's irresistible to a Nintendo fan.

But traditional fighters? Nope. Street Fighter, King of Fighters, Guilty Gear, Mortal Kombat. Dead or Alive, Tekken...none of these series have done well on Nintendo platforms. Except when the games came out on SNES, anyway. And the one exception when Soulcalibur II on Gamecube outsold both the PS2 and Xbox versions. But we can probably thank Link's inclusion in the roster for that.

But...WHY? Why don't Nintendo fans like fighting games? Nintendo gamers are usually quite open to a variety of genres (mostly because Nintendo themselves offer many different games in many different genres) but for some reason, fighting games just don't stick with modern Nintendo fans.

I had a theory that since the N64 didn't have many fighters (really good ones, anyway) that fans of the genre just gravitated to the Playstation since that's where the games were. And then never came back. But the N64 had nearly zero RPGs, but that genre is still very popular with Nintendo fans today. So that theory is bunk.

Another theory I had was that fighting games are kind of repetitious, and require practice for moves, button inputs and strategy. But then, the same could be said for Monster Hunter, and that's kind of taken off on Nintendo platforms. Heck, a lot of that applies to the still-very-popular Smash Bros. series. So that doesn't make sense either.

Then I was like, do Nintendo fans - in general - just not like competition? Like, they prefer to work together in a cooperative manner, rather than go head-to-head? But then I remembered that, besides the popularity of Smash Bros., games like Mario Kart and Pokémon feature fairly heated player-vs-player modes, and sell by the boatloads. So again...I'm at a loss to understand the fighting game aversion.

So... I turn to you guys. This site, this community...pretty much doesn't care for fighting games. Save for a few of you. If you don't like fighting games, can you explain to me why? I honestly just want to understand. If you DO like the genre, then....well, I guess this thread isn't for you. Still, any input would be greatly appreciated. Thanks everyone.

tl;dr version: WHY DON'T YOU LIKE FIGHTING GAMES?

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Posted: 02/07/14, 05:50:25  - Edited by 
 on: 02/07/14, 05:50:14
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Ok, I have a little story to tell (don't I always ).....'scroll down to the red if you don't give a sh!t about my life in mid 1990s'!

Let's take a trip back in time, if memory serves me right, I believe Street Fighter II was released for the SNES in 1994. I was an asst. manager for Cinnabon. The manager, Beth, had been away for a few days in Lancaster, Pa., where the base operations was located. During that time she had received a performance review and she received a bonus. To my surprise when she returned, she gave me a $100 since I was her right hand man. She said without me, she wouldn't be able to run the store at the exceptional level that qualified her for the bonus. I was really happy and I knew immediately that I would be blowing a good portion of that $100 on videogames.

There was an Electronics Boutique in the mall, (remember those before GS bought everyone out?) so I headed down that way, I think immediately upon getting my grubby little paws on the cash. I already had it in my mind that I would be buying that brand new game that just was released. You know, the one all the gaming magazines, like EGM, ect, were raving about cause it was almost a perfect port of the arcade version. Back then, thats all we had, no internet, just plain ole magazines. What game is this I'm raving on about, oh yea...

Super Street Fighter ll!! Now, I know this may seem a little strange, I really wasn't sure what all to expect from the game. I actually thought the game would be like the 'Final Fight' games. Back in the early-mid 80's arcades were everywhere and I frequented them quite alot. By 1994, I had already graduated from college. Actually, it had been 7 years, graduated in 1987. I was married back then and we had our first son, who was born in Dec 1992. The only arcade left was at the mall, and by now arcades were just barely a shell compared to the arcades of the 80s. Now, you had all those stupid machines that spit out tickets....you know the ones Im talking about. The only good ones were the skee ball machines, cause they were fun to play. You really didn't play for the tickets. Sure, you could, that is if you wanted, say a colored pencil that ended up costing you $10 in tickets.

So, even though there was an arcade close by, I hardly ever went in. I'm sure they had Street Fighter cabinets, but your guess would be as good as mine.

Back on topic..why I don't like fighting games!

When I made it to EB, I pretty much knew I was going to buy the new Street Fighter ll game for SNES. Though, there was other games I wanted as well, but this was the really 'HOT' new game out at retail. Plus, the game was bigger in size compared to any other game for the SNES, & along with the bigger sized cart plus the game being almost an exact arcade port, there was a bigger price tag of $74.99. Seriously, way back then, a game costing this much was unheard of...so how could I go wrong. I knew I would never pay this much out of my own money, plus I'll have about $25 left over. (if you didn't read the lead-in story, my manager received a bonus and she gave me a $100. I was asst. manager, she appreciated all my hard work that helped make the store a success.)

I was thinking this game is going to be great! Again, I was thinking along the lines of the Final Fight games, look at the detail in each of the characters . Look at the details in the stages. Just like today, I was into platformers, games like Starfox, gaming worlds with huge levels. This game is going to be awesome!

I go home, pop the game in, do a quick read through on the instructions, since I'd never played the game. I started out on a normal difficulty, I usually don't bother with the easy levels. First thing I figured out, 'this game is tough...really hard'. So, I shifted down the difficultly level. I also noticed there wasn't much to the stages, they scrolled a little, but not what I thought. Eventually, I did get better, even was able to beat the game on normal, but....THIS IS IT? You beat up on about 8 other fighters, a few bosses thrown in, and an end boss. Plus, a few bonus stages. I thought at higher difficultly levels, there would be more bosses or something....NOTHING...JUST A HARDER EXPERIENCE.

I pretty much felt like I wasted my money. I can't remember the return policies, I probably could have exchanged the game, but for some reason I didn't. Honestly, I think I kept the game hoping it would grow on me. This was the hot new game everyone is talking about! How can I not like it. Compared to other genres, like platformers, shooters, back then I'm talking about games like Starfox, Super R Type, ect., there wasn't much gaming to be had compared to every other genre out there.These games had huge, sprawling worlds to explore. I just thought Super Street Fighter ll was cheap. You just fight the same characters over and over, but at a higher difficulty, there was only a small set of stages, one for each character & they barely scrolled, same ole eye candy and oh yea, once you got up there and beat the game on a harder level, you received some little ending story for each character. Not enough for me to care.

I knew if I had someone to play against, that would increase the replayability, but to be honest, I didn't even care to go that route. Just to keep fighting over and over just seemed pointless to me and I was never really having any fun. So, for me, I don't like fighters cause I think they are boring and even playing against someone else just is not fun at all.

I will also say that the difficultly for fighters is a bit of a turnoff. Trying to figure out the button/stick movements so one can execute a special move, like a fireball, spinning kick, ect. is boring as well. I want all those moves made available. I don't get any fun by figuring out how to execute the move properly. Though, overall, most fighters seem to be difficult, even if I knew how to execute all the special moves, combos or whatever.

In a nutshell, I just don't feel the fun factor in the fighting genre. Even if the game is a Smash Bros game. Though, I will admit that I can tolerate and have more fun from the Smash Bros. games. Plus, I believe there was something along the lines of a story mode, plus those bonus stages were cool, can't remember what they were called. I remember my sons wanting to play the SSB games with me. I liked both Melee and Brawl, but I rarely would win, those games are hard for me to learn. Probably cause I never put in the amount of time like I would for other genres. Again, thats cause I didn't feel the fun. I would play a few rounds with my kids and I would want to quit, but I knew they would be bummed out, so I would force myself to play for about an hour. They could just keep playing and playing, having all kinds of fun. I wished I got the same fun factor from the game. Oh well, it is, what it is.
Posted: 02/08/14, 09:44:14  - Edited by 
 on: 02/08/14, 10:13:23
sirmastersephiroth said:
@GameDadGrant Depends on what system you have. I have a SF, MK, and Tekken on PS3 and Tekken Tag 2 on Wii U.

I think we can work something out. I've got Street Fighter on PS3 and Tekken on Wii U!

@gamewizard65

You call that a *little* story...?!?

Posted: 02/08/14, 14:46:21  - Edited by 
 on: 02/08/14, 14:48:21
@GameDadGrant

I've got: Super Street Fighter IV, Darkstalkers Collection, MK Trilogy, Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix, BlazBlue: CT, Virtua Fighter 2, Street Fighter III, Marvel vs. Capcom 2 on my PS3 for that matter.
Posted: 02/08/14, 15:25:20
@GameDadGrant

I actually cut out two hefty size paragaphs! I started talking about my least favorite genre, FPS. If I was to play a FPS, it would be for the campaign/story mode. Their online counterparts, IMO, are the most boring things ever to hit the videogaming landscape. For the life of me, I'll never understand the appeal of just gunning other players down, over & over & over, ect., then we have a winner/winning team who made it to the first, 'X' amount of kills.

Only reason I can't enjoy the campaign/story mode: I find FPS the hardest genre to control. I've mentioned this fact in other threads, I cannot control two analog sticks at the same time. Its akin to say, trying to make a clockwise motion with your left hand and trying to make a counter clockwise motion with the right hand. So, say I'm using the left analog stick and I'm moving my onscreen character to the left and I need to position the right analog to fire to the right. I find myself moving the right analog stick to the left as well. Maybe if I practiced more, but I honestly do not think I'm capable of properly controlling FPS.

Now, games like Metroid Prime Corruption, The Conduit, ect, games that used the new motion controlled setup, those I can control really easy. There are many people, like myself, that woud be able to enjoy the FPS genre if all these FPS developers would add just that extra control scheme. It would work for the Wii U and Sony PS 3&4 since the introduction of Move controller. People like to knock and bitch about motion controls, myself included because developers try to shoehorn them into games where they don't belong. They do have practical purposes though and should not be forgotten and tossed to the side.

Take games like RE4. No, its not a FPS, its a third person shooter, but pretty much, everyone agreed that when the game was ported to the Wii, using the wiimote and it's motion controls, the game as wonderful and fun as it was on the GC/PS2, became even more fun and easier to control due to the Wii's motion controller.
Posted: 02/08/14, 20:28:27
@GameDadGrant Are you getting Ultra Street Fighter IV?
Posted: 02/08/14, 20:53:33
@chrisbg99

I've always liked you, Chris!

@gamewizard65

I agree with ya on FPS games! Also, holy crap, you cut out two paragraphs before?

@sirmastersephiroth

You know it!
Posted: 02/08/14, 21:57:07
@GameDadGrant

Yeah I plan on getting the new Guilty Gear, KoFXIII and Persona 4 Arena one of these days. I've thought about getting the new MK but damn the memory needs on that are horrid.
Posted: 02/09/14, 02:51:19
nacthenud said:
I love fighting games. My favourite series are:
Street Fighter
Marvel vs Capcom
Soul Calibur
Virtua Fighter
Dead or Alive



...but I've also enjoyed a variety of other fighters.

I carved, painted and assembled myself a heavy wooden base to hold my PS3 arcade fightstick just for fighting games.




BUT, as much as I love Nintendo games, I'm hardly a "Nintendo gamer" exclusively - I'm a cross-platform gamer.

That's freaking awesome, by the way!!!
Posted: 02/09/14, 16:43:30
I guess I'm qualified to answer, since I fit the description of the topic to a 'T'. My number one beef with fighting games is having to remember a rapid succession of button presses COMBINED with directional inputs to carry out what I would consider to be a cool looking move. It seems pretty un-intuitive. I do like DOA, probably precisely because at its core they're trying to keep it a little more simple than that.
Posted: 02/10/14, 17:50:07
I don't like that Fighting games can come down to juggles and inescapable situations. The "fun" of it is replaced with an "algorithm" of sorts to which there is no return. The newer iterations of Madden are quickly falling into that category, too (CPU coverages being exploited on every play, plays that work 100% of the time, "nano blitzes," etc.). Mario Kart online has been a bit annoying as well (throw in cheating and call it a day).

Stuff like this makes me worry for something like Project CARS. Really looking forward to it, but I'm sure there'll by guys SNAKING all over the place or whatever makes them go faster that isn't drafting. Actually, Project CARS should be pretty safe from that stuff, but yeah.

EDIT- Super Street Fighter II and Mortal Kombat II are probably my favorites if I had to pick. I own both.
Posted: 02/11/14, 01:24:18  - Edited by 
 on: 02/11/14, 01:25:03
Though, to be honest and fair, The Street Fighter series and Smash Bros. series are my favorites when it comes to fighters. I did buy SF: IV for the 3ds, with gift card and marked down promo price, I ony paid around $15 for it brand new. I ended up selling it cause I wanted another game, I knew I would play more often. Actually, I was starting to get better at playing the game,

Smash Bros. games just have more fun factor. I know both of my sons keep getting on me about buying the new Smash Bros game for the Wii U when its released. It just depends on what other games I'm playing at the time, my backlog, ect.

I wonder if Nintendo will have any promos for those who want to buy both the Wii U/3DS versions? Or just having the promos to entice gamers into buying both versions. I know I would be more apt to buy both games, if the data could easily cross referenced between the two formats. I'm just stating that, esp if I was a hardcore Smash Bros. lover. Now, I'm not meaning that someone who owns the 3DS version could play against someone who owns the Wii U version. I'm only talking about the stats being easily moved back and forth.

The easiest way for that to happen would be with cloud saves, ect. Only other way I can think of is, taking your sd card out of the 3ds and inserting it in the Wii U to upload the Wii U's stats to the sd card, or vice versa.
Posted: 02/11/14, 07:17:14
Hey, would you guys be interested in a Negative World Fight Club?

It seems that most of you are uninterested in investing any amount of time into learning combos or "complicated" button inputs...but what if we just played each other? Maybe some of our fighting game veterans can teach the (comparatively) unexperienced the tricks of the trade? There are a handful of good online fighting games on Wii/Wii U and DS/3DS, and I think it could work if the community showed enough interest.

If nothing else, the "Fight Club" could also end up being the "center" for Smash Bros. meet-ups and tournaments, which are bound to happen anyway once the new games release later this year. (well, hopefully this year)

Thoughts?
Posted: 02/11/14, 17:19:13
Come on Grant, what's the first rule?

I'd be in to it.
Posted: 02/11/14, 18:39:03
@Stephen

Well, the first rule of Negative World Fight Club is; you don't talk about Negative World Fight Club.

The second rule is; YOU DO NOT TALK ABOUT NEGATIVE WORLD FIGHT CLUB.

The third rule is; ignore rules #1 and #2, and tell everyone about Negative World Fight Club, and tell them to join! The more the merrier!

Those are all the rules I have planned out so far.
Posted: 02/11/14, 20:14:12  - Edited by 
 on: 02/11/14, 20:14:27
I'd rather we organise a Negative World Peace Club.
Posted: 02/11/14, 22:00:39
Posted: 02/12/14, 05:23:07
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