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Zero Escape: Virtue's Last Reward (3DS) discussion [game]
 
Zero Escape: Virtue's Last Reward on the 3DS
9.3/10 from 11 user ratings

Welcome to the official discussion thread for Zero Escape: Virtue's Last Reward on the 3DS!

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Zero Escape: Virtue's Last Reward (Nintendo 3DS) Review (9.1)  by  
BEHOLD! The sequel to one of the best late-life DS games, 9 Hours, 9 Persons, 9 Doors is here! A brand new story, new characters (with some returning ones from the previous game) and puzzles galore, this sequel is a fantastic and very welcome addition to the 3DS library.

If you're ready for one of the most engrossing and engaging stories in the realm of video games, as well as clever puzzles and a unique gameplay progression complete with multiple endings depending on what you do, THIS IS THE GAME FOR YOU.

I was kind of hoping that Zero would make this thread (since it'd be pretty appropriate for him to do so - if you know the story of 999, I think you'll know what I'm talking about) but I'm not waiting any longer! Now is the time to discuss Zero Escape: Virtue's Last Reward!

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10/25/12, 17:44    Edited: 10/25/12, 17:47
 
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@Zero

I haven't played the game since it's release...I forget the ending. Might have to do some YouTube research to remind myself.
03/03/14, 16:09   
BTW, how do you know which areas you have gotten the gold files and which not? I'm guessing it has something to do with the [ARCHIVES X/Y] stuff on the flow screen, but what do those numbers mean? Like I have some that say 7/14, 11/12, etc. and I'm not sure what those numbers mean exactly.

Also, do you get anything particularly interesting if you collect them all?
03/03/14, 22:21   
@Zero

If you haven't gotten all the Gold files, you haven't finished the game. No wonder you thought it ended abruptly.

(And sorry, I can't remember off the top of my head the way you check).

...Go back and finish it properly.
03/03/14, 23:03   
Has there been any news, progress, or development regarding saving ZE3, yet?


btw, here's me until the game gets made:

03/04/14, 07:22   
@Zero

Ok, I've checked my copy of the game and I think the way to tell where you need the gold files is to check the Flow screen- Rooms you've Gold Filed will have a 'Hard' marking on them. The ones you don't...possibly an Easy marking or nothing at all. Not sure, I never switched to Easy mode.


Either that or check your passcode screen. One password is to clear the room, the other is for the file. It might be possible that you did the room in hard mode but only got the exit code and not the file code.
03/04/14, 10:05   
@Shadowlink I checked the password screens, was only missing two, went and got them, and... nothing new that I can see.

Maybe I got a password somewhere but forgot to use it, but I also have every screen on the SECRET archive tab full so I dunno... don't think so.

The last ending I got was below Phi... Infirmary Another Time which then leads to Another Time End. But I got that before getting all of the gold files. Despite the fact that every FAQ I read seems to think you need to get every single secret file to unlock this.

There is more after this?

PS. It just occurred to me that perhaps since my brother played through the game first it automatically unlocked all of the "secret" ending stuff and it stayed unlocked in my playthrough? Wouldn't make much sense but I could see that being the case. But um... then we're back to my original comment... the ending still felt abrupt to me.
03/04/14, 10:42   
Edited: 03/04/14, 10:51
@Zero

Hmm.

No that's it. From the wiki:

Another Time END - appears after viewing END or BEGINNING and having all puzzles completed on Hard mode with all archives collected.

Do the gold files contribute to the archives? Maybe not. I thought you needed them all, but I could be wrong.
03/04/14, 10:48   
Yeah, I guess it must have automatically unlocked that stuff for me because my brother played through first? Despite me starting a brand new game?

I'm assuming he unlocked everything.

Well then I AM finished! And I just stayed up way darn later than I should have getting files I didn't need!
03/04/14, 10:53   
Edited: 03/04/14, 10:54
@Zero

Oh he did?

Fuck that guy.
03/04/14, 10:55   
So I finally just got this game a week or two ago. Can't believe it took me so long after how much I loved 999.

Was a lot of fun, but I'm not without my fair share of complaints:

1. The repeated blinking-dot-on-a-map-and-watching-doors-open stuff got old on the FIRST timeline, by the end I was wanting to blow my brains out any time that map came up. Great. MORE DOT WATCHING. Pointless fluff.

2. The lack of logic of some the characters in a lot of the timelines is just silly. We confront Dio with an injection gun he was trying to hide from us. Not five minutes later, we find Luna "dead" due to an injection gun, we all accuse each other but NO ONE BRINGS UP THE INJECTION GUN.

3. The premise of the "Prisoner's Dilemma" element of the AB game makes no sense to me. Phi and Alice and a few others try to spell it out like you should obviously pick betray. But if everyone was truly logical, and even if you wanted to get out as quickly as possible, the only choice that makes sense for ANYONE is ally. If you choose betray, logically no one is going to ever ally with you again. So you've trapped yourself, or at best greatly extended how long you'll be in the game until someone trusts you again.

Furthermore, if you intend to pick betray with the intent of gaining points, then you already believe the other person is going to Ally! This, combined with the previous fact, means that no sane person would ever pick betray, not unless you were able to incapacitate your opponent in the AB game two games in a row without anyone getting suspicious.

4. How the hell did Sigma not notice the giant fucking robot monocle on his face in ANY timeline? I can understand not seeing his reflection, he intentionally designed the game so he couldn't see himself (aside from the pond in the Garden... which he looks directly into a few times but never sees himself I guess?) but no one even thought to bring up his eye?

5. While I enjoyed the game a great deal, I don't feel like the area was nearly as interesting as the faux-ship from the first game. Almost all of it was super... gray. It lacked variety.

6. I knew we were on the friggin' moon on the first ending I got. For some reason I thought we were looking at Mars, and not Earth (the eclipse thing had be a bit off), but definitely from the moon.

7. I knew Sigma was zero as soon as I found Knox's Ten Commandments. Why? Because they were clearly breaking literally every commandment even that early in the game. (Can't be the detective, and no doubles specifically gave this one away.)

8. Despite what some folks here thought, I found most of the gold files to be super lame. Over half of them literally just regurgitate what you heard not five minutes prior without providing additional detail, and precious few remain funny like the Gentleman Points of Grandpa's Videos. Even fewer actually grant insight, making their acquirement, aside from the "extra ending" almost useless for me.

9. Fuck that dice puzzle in the Q room.

10. Fuck that puzzle in the Infirmary where you have to mentally overlay the sheet over the boxes on the wall to get the password to open the unmarked drawer.

11. Fuck Alice's ridiculous boob necklace. It would literally make more sense for her to run around topless. I had hoped they'd move beyond this stupid crap after the first game and Ms. Hackerboobs, but no, it got even worse. Look, guy-making-game, your video game is already full of swearing and murder and craziness, if you want to add boobs, just add boobs. You don't need to cover them up with a big necklace. If you're not going to just add boobs, then give the fucking woman a shirt! That's just ridiculous!

12. Being beaten over the head with Schrodinger's Cat the entire game was kind of annoying, since people severely misunderstand the entire purpose of the creation of that silly thought experiment. I accepted it for story reasons, but good lord.

13. Having the main character be the only one not voice acted the entire game was weird and lame. Don't care what the story reasons may have been, it sucked. All these people have voices, I am "beepity-boopity-man" until I enter Kyle's body.

14. That rabbit made me want to eat my own brain.

15. The story wasn't as hard-hitting and impactful at the end. In 999, it melted your fucking brain once everything came together, it was just insane. It was an encapsulated story that made sense. There were a few loose ends but they were relatively minor. VLR doesn't even feel like a complete story. It feels like you're getting warmed up for a story. At the end you're just like "So... basically nothing happened and now the real stuff starts in the next game?"

Learning that it was the future wasn't a big surprise because it's heavily hinted at the entire game, I already knew we were on the moon, and I already also knew that the Earth was in bad shape (from Quark's letter about how they collect junk and Junpei has to explain what it is.) and even if I didn't, it doesn't occur until the end of the game, it's just some... vague... thing until the end, so I have no connection to the outside world.

I had guessed that Akane was the old woman long before it was revealed in the story, it was heavily hinted. Logically, since Tenmi was "chasing her" in one timeline and she was "very important" in another, it became clear that he was also Junpei, which also made it clear why Clover did him favors in some timelines and why he trusted her.


...
...

All that said, the game overall was great, and I hope they're able to get that funding they need to make a third one. Not quite as great as 999 since the concepts aren't new, but still a great game overall!
03/10/14, 16:38   
@Xbob42 Although I agree with 3 in principal, I think that is the whole point of the prisoner's dilemma... it is the most logical for everyone to pick ally... as long as you can trust that the others will do so. It's not about logic, it is about trust, and looking at the real world out there I have to say... I'm not sure that I'd trust people to be logical about this kind of thing. In fact, I think this game is the first time I've seen the prisoner's dilemma used where it really dawned on me why people might pick betray.

Now, what I don't get is why everyone wouldn't just sit down at the start and say this is how it is going to be... everyone will ally, we'll all leave together, and anyone who picks betray will face severe consequences from the group. Remove the having to trust strangers element and replace it with fearing consequences if you betray. Because this wasn't like the traditional prisoner's dilemma where you never have to face the person you betrayed again. In this case the group could hand out consequences to anyone who screwed up the larger plan.

And I definitely don't get how people were always able to "surprise" everyone else and get through the door once they hit 9. It should never have been a surprise, and everyone's first instinct should have been to guard the freaking door and take down anyone by force who had 9 and insisted on going through. Or heck, even if they didn't insist on going through. K is the only one who could maybe do it by force, but they could have come up with a K stopping plan somewhere in there.

And Alice's clothing choices were pretty insane. It sort of half made sense when the first game was suggesting that she might be the woman frozen for all of these years... I mean, still not really, but at least in the "completely different time / culture" way. But like... she is just a normal woman with the same name who looks the exact same or something? I never quite understood that part of things. Who the F is she?!
03/10/14, 18:39   
But it's NOT about trust -- because you have to trust someone to ally with you to betray them for points. And once you betray them, YOU no longer have trust and can practically never escape. Even in acting in 100% self-interest, the betray option only makes sense if you're 100% sure someone's going to betray you and you need to protect yourself or you'll die. This isn't like the prisoner's dilemma, in the prisoner's dilemma it's someone far away who you'll never even talk to.

In this game the person's right there. It would never make sense for anyone to pick betray, no matter how much or how little they trusted someone. You can't win with betray unless you do some incapacitatin', and then you've got suspicion on yourself and all manner of nonsense.

I would declare the first person to vote betray clinically insane. Whether you think everyone else is a selfish prick or not, even if they despise you... the quickest way out is always ally.
03/11/14, 03:09   
It's not that betray only makes sense if you are 100% sure someone is going to betray you, it is that betray starts to feel like a good option if you suspect someone might betray you and you can actually die very soon if it happens enough. Note the word 'feel", not actually is. You're sitting there thinking "Of course they will pick ally, that makes the most sense... but what if they don't AND I DIE BECAUSE OF IT?!" People are afraid of death and often act very irrationally to avoid it.

The thing about the prisoner's dilemma is that it absolutely isn't about the most logical way to do things. It wouldn't be a dilemma to a computer program that needs to calculate the best approach... I think? It's a dilemma to human beings with their fears and anxieties and trust issues.

Also keep in mind that not everyone had the goal of getting out the quickest.
03/11/14, 03:31   
Edited: 03/11/14, 03:32
Man, I thought I posted something here earlier calling Xbob a curmudgeon for all his complaints. Bah

@Xbob42

You have to remember though, there were people in the game who didn't want it to end quickly, what with all the ulterior motives.

'All ally, all the time' is nice in theory (and mostly worked in the 'good' ending), but once you start throwing a few spanners in the works (Like Dio's shenanigans and Radical 6 fun) things will go south pretty fast.
03/11/14, 03:34   
Trying to wrack my brain here thinking who didn't want out quickly...

Alice wanted out as quickly as possible.
Clover did as well.
Junpei did so long as he could take Quark, who also wanted out quickly.
K wanted out quickly due to his amnesia. He didn't know he lived there. K is of course Akane in the "true" ending path, but even then...
Luna didn't want out as quickly as everyone else but would always ally anyway.
Phi wanted out super quick.
Sigma also wanted out quick.
Dio was always the first one out the door in practically every ending, so even he wanted out quick.


Sorry, not buying the "not everyone wanted out quickly" thing. And the Radical 6 fun didn't change that, either. Then they just wanted to die.

Also, you're never going to die on the first round of the AB game, and also they don't know about that until later anyway. So not voting ally still makes no sense. Not buyin' any of these excuses. Lazy writing, is what I'm chalking it up to. The prisoner's dilemma is different, it deals with two fuckin' criminals who can never talk to or see each other regardless of outcome over a single round. It's practically not comparable aside from the shell of the exercise.

This is an easy game to win, and choosing betray, unless you plan to kill people, is essentially suicide. In a real life situation, you choose it once, you'd never get out. And you can't ally once and then betray, if you don't get two successful betrays in a row, you have to play 3 times, meaning it's never faster. If you're suspicious enough to think everyone's going to betray you (or even that certain people are) then you've basically accepted that you will live in the facility forever. Even a suspicious person's only rational choice is ally UNLESS they're up against an opponent who betrayed last round. Again, it's the exile effect.
03/11/14, 04:03   
Edited: 03/11/14, 04:06
This game is neat! I got my first..."ending" (?), and it was really more of a cliffhanger. Trying again now with new characters. My original route, I went with my gut: Tenmyouji seemed like a cool guy, so I stuck with him. Chose Ally and he Betrayed me. Decided to give him a second chance since he seemed earnest, and we both Allied in the next AB Game. Glad I trusted him. However, before he was going to spill the beans about a Mars mission, we all stumbled upon a dead body and one ticked off Clover.

The rabbit's voice is great. Like, fantastic. Full of character, weird and creative and you can tell the voice actress is having a blast. It randomly goes into all these different dialects, like Georgian, valley girl, goth voice, etc on a whim. Really fun to listen to.

@Xbob42

This is pretty true though. I like the Prisoner's Dilemma and it's cool having a game version of it, but I don't understand why these characters don't all just get together and talk through the benefits of everyone voting Ally. They'd all get 2 points, and Zero III said that there's no real limit to the game, so they'd just have to play it a couple times and then they'd be outta there. They should've all made a pact to vote Ally, and turn on whoever votes Betray. Tie them up and keep them from playing the next game so they'd default to Ally.

I thought the cast in 999 were a lot better at talking strategy through and trying to collectively figure out the best/most altruistic way of doing things. This new cast--while I might like them as a whole even better--really fall for Zero's games way too easily. Sometimes I just wanna smack 'em!
06/28/16, 22:03   
This game is extremely good. I'm about 30 hours in now and have hit several "locks," but also have learned a lot more of the story, including some big plotline bombshells. Just saw K's ending last night, and it was great--dramatic, exciting, left me with some answers and more questions and had big reveals and murder most foul. Can't wait to see what else awaits me. Virtue's Last Reward is really something special, and I'm really hoping it sticks the landing (IMO, 999's ending didn't quite hold up to scrutiny as well as much of the game).

The branching paths are compelling enough on their own, but the way the game actually works its decision-making into the storyline puts it above and beyond its contemporaries.

This is fast becoming one of my favorite 3DS games, up there with ALBW, FE:A and SSB3DS.
07/06/16, 18:48   
Edited: 07/06/16, 18:49
@TriforceBun

The ending may satisfy you. Maybe.

I thought 999's was intentionally vague but interesting enough to make it satisfying to me. VLR's is....well, you'll see.
07/06/16, 20:09   
Got Luna's ending today. Was a tearjerker. Game is still impressive, even though Quark's ending was a whole buncha nothin'. Excited about finally wrapping it up!
07/08/16, 00:51   
@TriforceBun

Oh that ending coupled with the music...
07/08/16, 05:05   
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