This is one of those situations where I'd really like to see it first hand to decide how I feel. Unfortunately I'll have to wait 6 months for that to happen. And who knows how they'll tweak it in translation.

Here's a translation of the conversation, if anyone is interested. It's disappointing, to say the least.

Also, it looks like the highest level of support between two homosexual characters is an A+ relationship, instead of the series's usual S rank support. That is downright insulting. I'm struggling to think of any rational defense for such a decision. All it does is alienate people without accomplishing anything. It's not even an attempt at a joke- it's just a blatant shot at homosexual couples.

@Guillaume
Has she played the game?

@TriforceBun

She doesn't have to play the game to have an opinion on its characters.

@Hero_Of_Hyrule
I think there're important distinctions to be made based on characterization (motivations, relationships), the way the story is set-up, and perhaps most relevant, the writing and dialogue itself, which often is difficult to localize properly without the a professional. Just seems like jumping the gun a bit when there're so many factors that haven't been experienced firsthand. Almost like the internet version of the Telephone game (you know, where you tell one guy a thing and he passes it on, etc).

The A+ thing instead of S is odd, although it makes me wonder if this game uses a "child" system like Awakening did and uses that to distinguish between couples that have a child or not.

If you ask me, the weirdest thing about FEF is still that bizarre Pokemon-amie mode.

That potion thing doesn't sound bad to me at all (unless I completely misunderstood what you guys wrote). Sounds like an interesting/*NEW* storyline in the Fire Emblem universe other than "I want to be a Knight, and fight for my family's honor with this sword." Anyway, being on The Internet, I've stumbled across some stuff out there where there are stories with potions that mess around with genders and desires and so on. Heck, even that Love Potion #9 song from the 1959 has it going on. Dude is kissing cops -- PRE-60'S! That part in Willow when Madmartigan is dusted? to fall in love with Sorsha, calling her all kinds of awesome things "my stars, my moon" or whatever, one of my favorite sequences. (I had the weirdest boner for Sorsha when I was younger. Like, I knew I wasn't supposed to like her...but like Madmartigan being dusted, I felt like I had been, too... Ah, the confusing times of growing up and learning about our bodies....) He just HATED her shortly before that, and now he's madly in love with her while she retains her old feelings. Hilarity ensues. And then they all get turned to pigs later on, something else you can find on the internet in fictional story form.

And to comment on T-Bun's comment earlier; I really don't know when it became "cool" to get offended about every single thing everywhere. Pretty annoying -- and if you are totally invested in something (ie: Gay Rights, Animal Rights, etc.), I get you being upset, but seriously...we're talking about EVERYTHING here. There isn't one thing posted on the internet where everybody is like "oh yeah, cool!!" Someone somewhere is bitching about something constantly. While there was some fun with the rainbow flags and confederate flags earlier in the week in GIF form, and its widely accepted as a rah-rah thing, keep in mind that there are many people on the other side of that fence who are very much unhappy with both outcomes, and that Venn diagram probably encompasses many of the same. I'm watching a lot of old wrestling lately, and you wouldn't believe how many confederate flags show up on wrestling costumes, especially in WCW. Pretty sure none of those guys were like "hell yeah, I'm totally racist!" They were just Wild Eyed Southern Boys or from Bad Street USA.

@Hero_Of_Hyrule
@TriforceBun

Can every other male-male or female-female relationship in the game achieve an S ranking?

Mr_Mustache said:

And to comment on T-Bun's comment earlier; I really don't know when it became "cool" to get offended about every single thing everywhere. Pretty annoying -- and if you are totally invested in something (ie: Gay Rights, Animal Rights, etc.), I get you being upset, but seriously...we're talking about EVERYTHING here. There isn't one thing posted on the internet where everybody is like "oh yeah, cool!!" Someone somewhere is bitching about something constantly.

Reminds me of a conversation between Mr. Burns and Lisa in a 'The Simpsons' episode, "Fraudcast News." I couldn't find a clip of the conversation online, but here's the exchange:

Mr. Burns: Well, what do you think of today's popular music scene?
Lisa: I think it distracts people from more important social issues.
Mr. Burns: My God, are you always "on"?

@GameDadGrant

It really is like that, and I don't get it. I think before it used to be a very small group of people, but now there is so much, it seems.

People like talking about things. Sometimes they are things that are important to them. Essentially we are seeing massive shifts in cultural consciousness right now, and people are pushing for corporations to keep up. I see no issue with this. If it annoys you well... tough. And prepare to keep being annoyed because it's not going to stop.

I guess we could go back to arguing about bits like we did in the 90s. Or remember how every single Gamecube / Wii game that was released without online was THE BIGGEST THING EVER to like half of the gaming population?

I'll take this over that any day.

@Mr_Mustache

People should speak up about media they find troubling. Painting the entire population as being constantly offended is just an easy way to dismiss issues that people have. The best thing you can do is listen to what complaints others have and form an opinion based on that. In this thread for example Zero explained what issues he took with the revised story and it lead to Guillaume (and myself) becoming more aware of a harmful myth that gets perpetuated. We only ever see the world through our own viewpoint so when someone tells us there is a problem it is good to give them the benefit of the doubt and hear them out on the matter. No one person is going to be knowledgeable about all the problems in the world.

Mr_Mustache said:

Can every other male-male or female-female relationship in the game achieve an S ranking?

What I read said that the highest support level characters of the same can achieve is A+. If there's a special S-level distinction for homosexual characters of the same sex, that went unmentioned.

None of this would of been a big deal if instead of using a magic powder, a spell was used. That way nobody could say she is drugged.Also, do none of you watch anime? I mean, her character type is very popular. This type of thing is nothing new in anime/Japan. This is just another case of westerners... Americans finding every little thing offensive. Also, her events are MEANT. TO. BE. FUNNY/RIDICULOUS. First, she passes out when she sees a cute girl. Funny, but it is an issue in the game world so the MC tries to fix it. Turns out it didn't work, which sucks, but she still had fun with both versions of the MC. During their study sessions, they end up liking each other. Then they get married.

And amount of ignorance about this game in general is staggering, ITT. Even more so in regard to common Japanese themes. People seem to forget how much they anime-fied the FE series. This is only an issue because games are more popular than anime. Thus, there is a larger verity of people who get to see this stuff.

God, I wish I had more intellect to get all my feeling across. One last thing. Before people start saying that Japan is homophobic, THEY HAVE MORE LGBT MEDIA THAN AMERICA! These devs tried to do something funny and STUPID IGNORANT MORONS took it the wrong way. AND SHE WASN'T EVEN DRUGGED. She was not unconscious nor in a stupor! All, that changed was her perception of the sexes. And for the people who will insist on saying she was drugged, who cares? Or should I say, why do you care? She was not taken advantage of, nothing bad happened. If anything, the results were in her favor. Now, she had a whole new set of cute girls to look at. You can correct me if I am wrong, but does it ever say that she actually loves any of these cute girls in a way that could elicit a romantic relationship? I love my cute dog, doesn't mean I want to start a romantic relation ship. The only time it is stated that she loves a female in a romantic way was when she saw the MC as a girl, whom she also loves as a man. There is the issue of rebelling against her dad, who HAPPENS TO BE A SKIRT CHASER! The whole situation makes sense when you realize who where father is. P.S. Her father is Inigo from FE:A. He is also in FEF, under the name of Lazward. Literally the same character. P.S.S This is one of her other possible relationships. SURPRISE IT IS A GUY.

I'll pray to any god that will keep this game unedited in the western areas. It doesn't need it in any way. People who can't handle stuff like this need not play it. Eff'd up crap happens all the time. This very mild compared to such things. Just be thankful that she isn't forcing herself on male prisoners, to get them to join the faction she belongs to. Oh, wait! While it is not her, there is a character exactly like that in FEF! Yet, nobody cares about that issue because it is only heavily implied!

@Shield Hero

I guess I'm a stupid ignorant moron. Please don't tell my mom; she'll be so ashamed.


EDIT: Moved what I added to a new post since stuff was posted while I edited it in here.

@Hero_Of_Hyrule

Hate all you want buddy. Also, edited my post a bit at the bottom.

@Shield Hero

Some of these arguments are pretty weak bro.

-It's not a potion it's a spell.
-Japan has different cultural norms
-It's based off anime so it's not a big deal
-It's meant to be funny
-There's arguably worse stuff in the game

The only objection I think has any merit is that people are ignorant of the game which is a fair point since it's not out yet here and no one has played it but people are going to judge what they hear/see of a game. After Fallout 4 was announced there was a rumor circulating that you couldn't play as a female character like in previous games and people were getting upset about it. It turns out you can play as a female character so the outrage was rather pointless. That being said I don't think anyone here is that angry since all we have to go on are these summaries. Tbun had said before that people should experience the story before getting worked up and I think that's fair although I would still advise a critical eye to what people are saying the plot consists of.

@Shield Hero

What do I hate and when did I say I or imply hate it?

The issues people have with the storyline, at least here, don't seem to be about a hetersexual man taking advantage of a homosexual woman by putting her into a stupor. It has more to do with tapping into harmful tropes and stereotypes. Maybe this wouldn't be as big of an issue if this there were more homosexual relationships in this game and games in general. But in a world where having two homosexual relationship options out of dozens of other potential relationships in a game is a rarity, it's not unfair to ask that those rare homosexual characters be treated with respect and that their sexuality be treated with the same legitimacy as their heterosexual counterparts. If there were, say, 19 positive examples of homosexual characters in the game, then maybe this wouldn't be as frustrating as it is. But when we're struggling to have homosexual characters included at all, it's not unreasonable to ask that those characters refrain from falling back on stereotypes or treating homosexuality as something that you just snap out of.

@Hero_Of_Hyrule

I'm just asking because in a lot of Fire Emblem games that I've played, certain characters just can't reach that S-rank. I see nothing wrong with that. Would a big stink be made if Brom and Devdan from Radiant Dawn couldn't form an S-rank relationship? I sincerely think not.

@Mr_Mustache

Can we retroactively make a big stink that Nephenee and Heather didn't get a S-rank relationship?

@Mr_Mustache

I would be very disappointed if Brom and Devdan became romantically involved and were arbitrarily denied an S-rank relationship. In the two 3DS games the S rank relationship is used to signify marriage or some other lifelong romantic relationship.

@Hero_Of_Hyrule
@Mr_Mustache

Apparently it is possible to have a same sex S rank relationship in Fates. I found this on the Fire Emblem Wiki.

Also, players can have same sex S-Supports if they attain the rank with Zero and Shara for males and females respectively. Achieving S-Supports under these circumstances will still result in the children Kanna and Éponine in the case of Zero. The characters will also gain new quotes in the My Castle My Room skinship feature if they are S-Supported with the Avatar. Special A+ Supports exist for the Nohrian and Hoshidan royal families and their respective members of their personal guards. A+ Supports allow those units to share classes with each other.

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