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05/17/13, 17:51 |
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05/17/13, 18:56 |
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I totally agree. For me the launch was good because of the breadth of titles, but nothing stood out compared to previous Nintendo launches. Since then, it's like they're not even trying to sell consoles yet. Which is equal parts reassuring and worrying.
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on: 05/19/13, 02:57 |
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@AnandWell, the Wii U launch did suck. There's that.
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on: 05/19/13, 03:32 |
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@kriswrightAs a card carrying member of the group of 5, I agree. The Wii U had some good games at launch from both Nintendo and 3rd parties. Arkham City and Mass Effect 3 are incredible titles and it also had sales powerhouses like AC3 and Call of Duty. On the Nintendo front I have heard that both NSMBU and Nintendoland are pretty good as well. That still makes for an awful launch. Gamers who cared about any of those 3rd party games already had the means to play them (and in the case of ME3 and AC many already did). The Nintendo titles were incredibly safe. NSMBU and Nintendoland are fine games but they are not good games to make people excited about a new system. The Wii U launch would have been better if you traded all of the games it did launch with for one Super Mario 64. Something that gets people excited about the next step in gaming. You just cannot do that with a Mario sidescroller that follows the formula of something from the 90s, a collection of mini games, and a bunch of ports some of which were over a year old.
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on: 05/19/13, 14:01 |
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Well, except Nintendo did do it with a collection of mini games on the Wii. Sure Zelda was at launch too, but that wasn't the game everyone was going nuts over, it was Wii Sports. So it's possible. They just didn't really recapture that this time around.
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on: 05/19/13, 15:28 |
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@kriswrightThe word "suck" is relative, and therefore cannot in good faith be used for the Wii U launch, due to comparatively terrible launches like the DS. And 3DS. I'm not going to throw the VB under the bus, because most of its tiny, tiny library is pretty decent. So it wasn't... proportionately terrible? @StephenNintendoLand isn't safe at all. And NSMBU might not have lit the world on fire, possibly due to 2D Mario fatigue, but it's easy (and popular) to confidently analyze industry events with 20/20 hindsight. Could you have predicted its fate as confidently before it launched, considering the incredible sales of NSMB? Not that it really changes your point. I'm just curious. People are acting like Nintendo didn't even try, but they obviously did, and I could see both titles having taken off in some alternate universe, where the appeal of NintendoLand was effectively demonstrated/communicated and NSMB 2 didn't steal NSMB U's thunder. NintendoLand and NSMB U could have theoretically been the Wii Sports and Zelda of the Wii U. That was probably Nintendo's idea, anyway. Regardless of how it all turned out, was it a totally irrational notion? Also, the '90s?
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on: 05/19/13, 16:48 |
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05/19/13, 16:48 |
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I can honestly admit that I expected more out of NSMB U. I think it will still ultimately sell well, but Nintendo recently announced that it has sold some 700k or whatever in the US and I was thinking... really? The franchise that sold multi-millions everywhere else is struggling to hit a million a half a year into its life cycle? I'm sure it is over a million worldwide but still.
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on: 05/19/13, 16:57 |
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I did, too. It seemed like a smart idea to me. (Launching NSMB 2 right before it, not so much.)
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on: 05/19/13, 17:05 |
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Perhaps they should have actually pumped some money into increasing the production values of the damn thing... it still looks, plays, and sounds nearly identical to the previous games in the series, one of which just released half a year ago. That's not exactly enough to convince most people that they should drop a few hundred on a new console to play it. Maybe the game will continue to sell steadily as the Wii U install base increases.
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on: 05/19/13, 18:22 |
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@Hinph Oh yeah, I agree 100%. In fact, I think the same game with a brand new art style that really pushed the system... maybe that would have made a significant difference? Maybe not though.
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on: 05/19/13, 18:30 |
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@Zero The difference is that NSMB for the DS and Wii and 3DS had huge system install bases to work with when they launched. And they still weren't Halo/COD-level launch sales (in America), they just had great launches and kept the momentum rolling for years. But NSMBU was launched alongside a new system that the mainstream knew nothing about, and among the hardcore it had none of Wii's buzz or intrigue and all of its ire. And NSMB2 came out just a few months earlier for $20 less. If NSMBU was going to even come close to the sales of previous NSMB games in the short term, there had to be a killer app in the launch lineup, because nobody was going to buy a whole new system just for more NSMB. Nintendo Land and a bunch of 3rd party games everybody already played weren't up to the task. If the Wii U becomes a success, NSMBU's evergreen value will probably keep it selling decently through its lifespan. But it was never going to be a system seller on its own. But seriously guys, stop ruining this Sonic thread with your stupid lame Mario talk. We should all be talking about how much we love the blue dude with the 'tude!
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on: 05/19/13, 18:40 |
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05/19/13, 18:42 |
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I wouldn't say that the Wii U launch sucked, because it's better than the GameCube, and a lot better than various failed systems over the years. But compared to any other Nintendo home console? It's definitely weak. @Zero NSMBU has sold 2.15 million as of March 31st.
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on: 05/19/13, 20:43 |
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@Mop it up If you count Super Smash Bros Melee in with the Gamecube's launch (it came out three weeks later), then Gamecube had arguably the best launch of all time. Rogue Leader, Luigi's Mansion, Super Monkey Ball, Wave Race Blue Storm, and Tony Hawk 3 were no slouches, either.
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on: 05/19/13, 22:50 |
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05/19/13, 22:51 |
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@nate38 I was just counting the launch day releases. But yes, if it's the launch window (and not the ridiculous five-month launch window that Nintendo tried to come up with), then the Wii U is the worst on the home console side.
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on: 05/19/13, 22:53 |
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Yeah, it's really the "launch window" of the Wii U that turned out to be a colossal disappointment. Hopefully everything starts to turn around with Pikmin 3 and beyond.
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on: 05/20/13, 03:22 |
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@AnandOh believe me, this is not hindsight talking. I try not to speak in absolutes about anything I am unsure of. When the Wii U launch line-up was shown I said I did not see a killer app and that it was unlikely I would buy one. There was also a thread where I argued for 9 pages that simply having NSMBU at launch did not guarantee success, it was also about 3rd parties and I mentioned the Virtual Boy. Fun times. Would I have called it a bad business move at the time? I can't remember. I was definitely skeptical as a consumer and wondering when the really compelling software would be shown.
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on: 05/20/13, 14:49 |
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@kriswright@StephenSo we know for next time (...), what needs to be required Day 1 for a Launch Lineup to NOT "suck?"
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on: 05/21/13, 01:17 |
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@Mr_MustacheOk, I'll start with this, because it never hurts to say it: Whether something sucks is an opinion. So I respect if anyone disagrees with me on this. I do not think my opinion is law. Never have. Never will. We can agree to disagree. What isn't an opinion, though, is whether or not anyone could have foreseen that NSMBU and Co weren't going to be enough to launch the Wii U strongly. And Stephen, Pogue and I were pretty clear coming out of E3 last year that we didn't think those games would be enough. (Thus, the Group of 5 jokes. 5 being our demoralized hype level coming out of E3.) What did Nintendo need? Well, the obvious is to say "that one tentpole game". I know that's much easier said than done and I don't fault any company for trying and simply not coming up with one. Obviously. But I didn't really see anything trying very hard to raise the tent at E3 last year. I think maybe the big N thought Nintendo Land would be that game. Which was frankly optimistic, having played it. But I understand the thinking at least: Try to hit that Wii Sports target, again. But then my criticism could be reworded "Nintendo needed that one tentpole game that, incidentally, doesn't look constructed out of Care Bear barf." What happened to all that discussion about Wii Sports looking generic so it would be more inviting? Seriously, though, the biggest problem the Wii U had was the lack of surprise in the launch. NSMBU is a quality game, but it's probably the least surprising Mario platformer ever. It's the very definition of a safe game. We used to criticize the HD Twins, early in their lifecycles, for just giving everyone the same old games in HD. Well... that criticism came back to bite us this time because it's precisely what NSMBU is. Great game, but probably the quintessential unsurprising game. The least essential new console 2D Mario release ever. Add to this a huge deck of overpriced ports of games most gamers have played already and no single game that demonstrates unequivocally that the Wii U has any more power under the hood than cheaper game systems with bigger libraries of cheaper games and... well, no surprises here, other than Nintendo's uncharacteristic lack of ambition. That's where I'd say it sucked. That said, I'm talking from the perspective of a hardware launch. I've still had some fun experiences on the Wii U. I liked Lego City Undercover quite a lot. I love the dual screen action of Sonic Transformed. And NSMBU, Nintendo Land and Zombi U still have their qualities. I just see it as a launch lineup of all braves and no chiefs. Mix this with the fact that Nintendo still isn't adequate enough with network play (Nintendo Land, hello!) and didn't even try to give us an idea before launch of what they're working on long term for the Wii U, and I think it was clear they were going to get underwhelming numbers.
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on: 05/21/13, 19:20 |
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I remember the Group of 5. Good times. olo
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on: 05/21/13, 19:24 |
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I think even the most ardent Nintendo fan can agree. There's plenty of fun to be had, but nothing that jumps out as a must-have. Not yet, anyway. What I hear most lately is, "All those games Nintendo is announcing; I'll buy one next year when some of them are out." And while that might not be what's best for Nintendo, that's what's best for the consumers, so I don't fault them at all. I don't think any of the Sega games will fill that void, but then again, I was on the Nintendo side of the fan wars of the 90's, so I always underestimate the hedgehog. 
| Posted by |
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on: 05/21/13, 19:28 |
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nate38 said:But seriously guys, stop ruining this Sonic thread with your stupid lame Mario talk. We should all be talking about how much we love the blue dude with the 'tude![/quote]This is a Sonic thread?!@StephenLink?J/K, I believe you. It makes my life easier.
| Posted by |
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on: 05/24/13, 05:21 |
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05/24/13, 05:21 |
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