Every single gaming editorial publication is asked this at least once in their lifetime. Why did you give a perfect score to to a game with flaws? I was recently asked this question in my latest review for The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time 3D. It's a fair question and, in order to answer it, I need to get a little bit technical and philosophical at the same time.
A perfect game is not a flawless game. Negative World, like some other sites, has a review scale that goes from 0-10. If there is a game that is so terrible with absolutely no redeeming qualities (not even one), then I think it should deserve a big fat zero. However, if there is a game out there that does absolutely everything right, with maybe one or two meaningless wrinkles that are wholly overshadowed by the rest of the positives, then I don't see why I should deny the rarely given and elusive "Perfect Score." Like Anthony Burch once wrote (yes THAT Anthony Burch), "Perfection is an ideal, never to be practically reached by any art form at any time. That's just the way it works. With that in mind, why would you waste an entire point on the 1-10 grading scale by devoting it to something that can, by definition, never truly exist? Instead of calling 10/10 "perfect," why not just call it "will cure cancer"? They're both equally likely to happen within our lifetimes. To hold the 10/10 score back as an ideal for the perfect game, just in case it ever exists, is to degrade the entire 1-10 system into a 1-9.9 scale."
I feel that a "Perfect" game comes out maybe 1-2 times per system (sometimes 3 if we are lucky) , if that system has a lifetime of 4+ years. Let me list how many "perfect" scores there are per system, in my opinion.
NES: 1 Game Boy: 0 Game Boy Color: 0 For now. There are 4 games I want to play before making my final judgment. Game Boy Advance: 1 SNES: 5 I find that the SNES constitutes the Golden Era of gaming. N64: 2 And you already know one of them. Game Cube: 1 and it's not Wind Waker or Super Mario Sunshine DS: 2 and they are both remakes. Wii: 1 I have to finish another game to see if it is worthy of a 10, but I'm not playing it soon. 3DS: 1 for now.
Game Gear: 0 Genesis: 0
PS1: 2 PS2: 0 PS3: 3 PSP: 0
XBOX: 0 XBOX 360: 2
If you look at other sites, you will see that, even though they have perfect scores in their review scales, they all agree that there is no such thing as a perfect game. I leave you with some examples:
Gamespot: 10.0: PrimeThis exceedingly rare score refers to a game that is as perfect as a game can aspire to be at its time of release. Obviously, the constantly changing standards for technology and gameplay will probably make this game obsolete some day, but at its time of release, a game earning this score could not have been improved upon in any meaningful way.
Nintendo World Report: 10 - We don't believe any game can actually be "perfect." But some can get pretty close. We give our highest grade to games which are the best of the best. Games that aren't necessarily "generation-defining" can still be given top marks for this reason; if a game is all it can be and stands out among those like it, it can get high marks, too.
Game Informer: Outstanding: A truly elite title that is nearly perfect in every way. The score is given out rarely and and indicates a game that cannot be missed.
And my favorite definition of a "Perfect Game" goes to IGN:
IGN: 10.0 - Masterpiece The pinnacle of gaming, a masterpiece may not be flawless, but it is so exceptional that it is hard to imagine a game being better. At the time of its release, this game is the not just the best the system can offer, but better than we could have expected.
Example: The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time
I would like to conclude the same way I began, just to hammer the point. A perfect game is not a flawless game.
@sirmastersephiroth Damn, I totally forgot that Jeff Gerstmann was the one fired from Gamespot. I never liked Gamespot much, so I didn't really think about his name, but now it's all come full circle and he has a site far superior to what Gamespot ever was with ethics and values far superior to any other on the web when it comes to game reviews in general. They do so many things no other gaming website can come close to that it's really incredible. I've never really wanted to work for a gaming website before, but I think I'd be in heaven working over at Giant Bomb. Also helps that they're like 20 minutes away, since they're San Francisco based.
I'm a huge Giant Bomb fanboy too and think that along with The Escapist, they're providing a quality and variety of content that puts virtually all other gaming sites to shame.
Their Quick Looks, Giant Bombcast, etc. bring me more insight and entertainment than practically all the others combined.
Dude. I watch Quick Looks, completely random ones, just because it's so entertaining to watch them play games. It has literally put about 20 extra games into my "Have to buy it" list, because I wouldn't have looked twice otherwise. Stuff's poisonous!
I have a nuanced view of this debate when it comes to Ocarina of Time for 3DS. I firmly believe the following two things:
1.) Ocarina of Time is still a transcendent masterpiece. 2.) Ocarina of Time 3DS is not a 10 or particularly close.
This has nothing to do with current games surpassing Ocarina of Time. It's still by far the best 3D Zelda to me and probably the best 3D action adventure game. But if you're rating a rerelease of a game, it can't coast on its previous brilliance in my opinion. The game is not what it was to me in 1996 because it isn't new. Pretty much nothing in life resonates as much after you've been exposed to it many times, no matter how good it is. And it isn't what it was the video game world anymore, because it isn't groundbreaking. That ground has long been broken.
So you're left to rate the enhancements. These could conceivably be groundbreaking for the industry and could make the game feel so new that it would resonate with me the way the game once did. But OOT 3DS did not. So, to me, it's not a 10. (And I'm not saying these are necessary components of a 10, but they are considerations).
Anyway, that's just my personal rating, not yours so don't take this as me saying I think your score is wrong or anything. It's your review so your criteria.
@Jargon I appreciate you way of thinking and your respect for my criteria, as I respect yours. You, me, @gencid, and everyone else here have presented their views on this topic at length and have substantiated their opinions. Everyone is entitled to their views as long as their opinions are genuine. We can have lengthily debates on the merits (or flaws) of games ad nauseam as long as no one ever takes the Armond White approach, i.e. hating on something just to be a contrarian. We may have heated arguments at times but, thankfully, not one person here acts that way. Gigers doesn't post here anymore right?
For me, there are games that were so good to begin with, that they need little help in achieving a great or perfect score if they are rereleased again. Of course, if they just port the game as is, they can sure as heck expect me to rate it accordingly. To me, OOT3D hits everything it needs to hit to regain a perfect score.
On the other hand, let me talk about game that needs to be tweaked in order to reach a perfect score. That game is Wind Waker. For the Gamecube, I would rate WW a solid 9.0 or 9.5. It is a magnificent game with excellent controls, sound, and gameplay. However, in my opinion, there are certain aspects of the game that need to be changed in order to become a "perfect scoring" game. There should be more dungeons (which will translate to more bosses and special items), the interminable Triforce fetch quest should be tweaked, and more big islands should be added to the world to make it more robust. Add in a 3D, Mirrored Master Quest, Boss Challenge Mode, and a Gauntlet and you're golden. The graphics and music were perfect to begin with, so they should only be tweaked to fit within the system specs.
Some may argue that there are only 5 dungeons in Majora's Mask (including the moon), compared to Wind Waker's 6 and Ocarina's 9 (including Ganon's Tower on both) but Majora's Mask has so much variety in terms of side quests and even "playable characters" that it balances out. If they want to add in extra dungeons for Majora then great. If not, I guess I'll just spend 20 hours doing awesome side quests and having just as much fun. However, they should also add in a 3D, Mirrored Master Quest, Boss Challenge Mode, and a Gauntlet if you want this game to be just as good as OOT3D.
In fact, since we are talking about remakes let me list some excellent remakes, some good remakes, and some horrible remakes.
Great Remakes Pokemon Soul Silver/Heart Gold: Took the best game in the series (Crystal) and overhauled the graphics, sound, and gameplay. They also added every single Pokemon in existence up to date and made the games comparable and compatible with the current generation games. They added in the awesome Pokewalker to boot. The only thing I wish was there was the Pokegear, but it would have been chronologically impossible since it didn’t exist back then.
Chrono Trigger DS: It left the perfect graphics and sound alone but it added touchscreen elements, all the features from the PS1 version (including movies) and lots of extra content including an extra ending. The new long sidequests may not be as great as the original game, but it is completely optional and doesn't detract from the game at all.
Bionic Commando Rearmed: Overhauled the NES graphics and sound and even tweaked the gameplay where necessary. It also added a challenge mode and Co-op play.
Castlevania Dracula X Chronicles: Overhauled the graphics and sound. Eliminated those horrible and dated anime cutscenes and replaced them with much better CG. They also included the original version and even the absolute masterpiece of a sequel Symphony of the Night in the package with new voice acting and a better translation.
Resident Evil: This game is a reimagining of the original game with much better graphics and sound. It has far better voice acting and dialogue, plus a more serious tone that lends itself well to the gravity of the game. The controls have also been improved a bit.
SSFII Turbe HD Remix: Better graphics and sound and even rebalanced gameplay and online play. This is pretty much all that was needed for this game to be better and that is all they did.
Tomb Raider Anniversary: A reimagining along the lines of Resident Evil. It took the gameplay from the original and made it far more fluid, adding elements from the current games. It also overhauled the graphics and sound.
Donkey Kong: The first game had four levels. This one has 100 and far better gameplay. The only thing missing was color. They should have done a DX version just like with Link’s Awakening. Read the review by Ludist210.
Link’s Awakening: Speaking of which, this game was already excellent in its own right. All they had to do was add color. They went a little bit farther by adding a new dungeon with two new tunics and Game Boy Printer support. Read the review by Ludist210.
Super Castlevania IV: Take the original Castlevania NES game, overhaul the graphics and give it a masterpeice of a soundtrack, along with better gameplay and you have one of the best remakes ever.
Good Remakes
Final Fantasy IV DS: They changed the graphics, music, and even some of the gameplay. What they got was a better looking and sounding remake that lost all the charm of the original’s graphics and music.
Metal Gear Solid: Twin Snakes: The game looks great and play great adding elements from MGS2 such as a first person camera view, and a different perspective, plus a few other things. What they did wrong was breaking some of the boss battles (Ocelot and the second battle with Sniper Wolf) by making them too easy. Also they inexplicably changed Mei Ling’s accent even though she’s played by the same actress.
Super Mario 64 DS: Better graphics, more levels, added mini-games, 3 new playable characters. This should have been the must-own version of SM64. However, there is something that did not translate as well, the controls. Since the DS didn’t have an analogue stick, they had to make do with the touchscreen or the D-Pad. While the two are serviceable, they aren’t even close to controlling as well as the analogue stick. It wasn’t until the 3DS was released and I could play the game with the C-Pad that I was finally able to enjoy it. The C-Pad doesn’t make the controls magically analogue, but it makes the digital inputs control much more smoothly.
Horrible Remakes
TMNT Turtles in Time: Reshelled: I would have much better preferred a port of the SNES version on the Virtual Console than this piece of crap. The overhauled the graphics and sound completely eliminating the charm of the original game. They also changed the mechanics of the game which makes it control much differently than the original. Also, this is a port of the Arcade Game rather than the Superior SNES port. Therefore you lose some new stages and bosses. Did I also mention that the music is horrendous?
Super Mario All-Stars Wii: This isn’t a remake. Someone dumped a SNES ROM onto a Wii Disc and put it in special packaging, took a sentence of two about the game from the people involved and put it on a booklet, put some random Mario music onto a CD, and charged you $30 bucks for it. This is what SMAS Wii is, the most half-assed attempt at retaking your money ever. And that’s how they celebrated the anniversary of the Super Mario Bros. Series. They should have just released this game on the Virtual Console and called it a day. Read the review by GelatinousEncore.
Totally going against the point of your post, but I wanted to say that while Final Fantasy IV on the DS lost the original's charm, it gained its own! I enjoy both games immensely, although the PSP version is the defacto game, what with enhanced graphics (But still very, very similar to the original, just better looking and a few special effects here and there.), the After Years, and the Interlude or whatever. I have yet to play it, but Giant Bomb made me want it... bad.
@sirmastersephiroth There sort of IS a 'DX version' of DK '94 (which I wouldn't consider a remake, but whatever): Just pop it into a Super Game Boy cartridge.
@sirmastersephiroth There sort of IS a 'DX version' of DK '94 (which I wouldn't consider a remake, but whatever): Just pop it into a Super Game Boy cartridge.
True. But it doesn't work on the 3DS version unfortunately. I wish they would have Super Game Boy support on the 3DS.
I guess the difference between me and you is that I want the review to be objective, while you insist it should be subjective. Now, it might be impossible to achieve objectivity in things of a subjective nature like games, art, music, etc. But that doesn't mean the reviewer shouldn't try to be as objective as he can in his written "recommendation".
Going back to the perfect "10" score, just because I said I liked a few non-10 games more than a couple which I gave a 10, it doesn't mean that those games weren't any fun or aren't amongst my favorites. The difference between 9.5 and 10 isn't huge. But I'd reserve a 10 only for those games that are not only tons of fun, but also mechanically sound and technically the best in their class.
I was going to stop here, but you had to bring Simon's Quest up, didn't you? . I know that many people consider it the black sheep of the Castlevania series (therefore my score cannot be objective), but I still think that game in 1988 deserved a 10 as far as me and many of my friends that played it back then are concerned. Metroidvania is nothing more than the evolution of Castlevania II and SOTN is basically Simon's Quest's bitch. False clues were hilarious and more realistic (as gossips) than some annoying fairy that treats you like a dumb ass all the way. Where is the realism in a NPC telling you to press some button? "Hey, listen". No, thanks.*
*You probably already know that one of those 10's I mentioned earlier belonged to the original OOT. Therefore philosophy aside, if you feel that the game deserves a 10, by all means give it a 10. I respect your review just as much as I disagree with its overall score.
@sirmastersephirothI guess the difference between me and you is that I want the review to be objective, while you insist it should be subjective. For example you said that you would give a 10 to Pac-Man on 360 because YOU had fun, not because there are any universally shared values there, which is what I look for in a review. If I wanted a subjective opinion, I would simply ask whether you liked it or not. I don't have to read paragraphs of text and much less look for a score to tell me "how much you like it".
I actually want a review to be as objective as possible without the reviewer losing his sense of individuality. If the reviewer feels that a game deserves a perfect score because he enjoyed it immensely and the game is mechanically sound as you say, then so be it. I feel OOT3D meets my objective and subjective requirements. I also disagree with reviewing based on universally shared values. What's the point of reviewing a game if I'm going to have to defer to someone else's opinion of what's good and what's not? I might as well just copy and paste someone else's opinion, put my name on it, and call it a day. By the way, I never said I would give Pac-Man CE/DX a 10. I just mentioned it when I was talking about a game that doesn't take advantage of the system as much as Gears (per the designer's choice) but that I have much better time with. I only consider two 360 titles, so far, to be 10s, and they are both multi-console (Arkham Asylum and Assassin's Creed 2).
Also, to clarify, just because I said I liked a few non-10 games more than a couple which I gave a 10, it doesn't mean that those games weren't any fun or aren't amongst my favorites. The difference between 9.5 and 10 isn't huge. But I reserve a 10 only for those games that are not only tons of fun, but also mechanically sound and technically the best in their class.
I feel the same way. We just have different opinions on what games are fun and mechanically sound. Although, judging from your list, the difference isn't too big. The only clearly different games are Simon's Quest, Donkey Kong Country, and Mortal Kombat II. I would have scored DKC and MKII a little bit lower, maybe a 9.0-9.5. We both enjoyed the last two games but I don't feel they reach perfection, or ever did. The only game we have a huge difference of opinion is Simon's Quest. But you know, it takes different strokes to move the world.
@sirmastersephirothDoes that mean that I am always objective? Not really. You brought up Simon's Quest which many people consider it the black sheep of the Castlevania series (therefore my score cannot be objective). But I still think that game in 1988 deserved a 10 as far as I am concerned. Metroidvania is nothing more than the evolution of Castlevania II and SOTN is basically Simon's Quest's bitch. False clues were hilarious and more realistic (as gossips) than some annoying fairy that treats you like a dumb ass all the way. Where is the realism in a NPC telling you to press some button? "Hey, listen". No, thanks.*
A review is an opinion. An opinion comes from an individual. Every individual in the world has different experiences and different tastes. Therefore each opinion is going to be different, as clearly evidenced by the comments in this editorial. A game, by definition, is supposed to entertain you. Therefore, how can you review what entertains you without putting in your opinion, which is always going to be personal? If you enjoyed Simon's Quest, then that means that your definition of entertainment and a mechanically sound game is very different from mine. You feel that Simon's Quest was a 10 back in the day. I would have given it a 6 at most. And I know I'm not the only one...
@sirmastersephiroth Yeah, I've been longing for Super Game Boy emulation on Nintendo's recent stuff. I guess I'll just have to bite the bullet and grab a SuperGB.
@anon_mastermind I mentioned it because it was such a blatant attempt at making cash without changing anything. It was the 25th Anniversary of Super Mario Bros.and all Nintendo did was put an SNES game on a Wii disc. They should have just released the game on the VC. The only reason I bought it is because I never owned the SNES game and that was an excellent remake in it's own right. Ludist210's review is spot on.
TMNTReshelled was a huge disappointment for me. All I wanted was a VC port of the SNES game on my Wii. What we got was a totally different game with none of the original charm or fun factor. The game was taken off the North American stores on June 30th because of licensing issues. They probably knew it was so bad they didn't bother to renegotiate the license. Sad thing is, I don't think we'll ever see TMMT Turtles in Time on the VC.
@sirmastersephiroth I think Nintendo did the right thing by releasing it at retail, that way it could reach a much larger audience. They were never going to release it on the VC for 8 dollars, when all the games separately total around 20 dollars. All in all, the bonus stuff was a bit underwhelming and you're right that Mario deserved a better 25th anniversary party than that. If it were $20 instead of $30 retail, it would have been a great value IMO. But the demand was there, and $30 was spot-on pricing for Nintendo.
I hope the VC gets the rest of the NES Ninja Turtles games, as well as Turtles in Time and the Genesis game too. I don't see it happening though, sadly.
Just wanted to say that I appreciated the way you handled this thread and that you took your time to patiently explain yourself without resorting to name calling or swearing like someone else who knows who they are. Respect +1.
. I know that many people consider it the black sheep of the Castlevania series (therefore my score cannot be objective), but I still think that game in 1988 deserved a 10 as far as me and many of my friends that played it back then are concerned. Metroidvania is nothing more than the evolution of Castlevania II and SOTN is basically Simon's Quest's bitch. False clues were hilarious and more realistic (as gossips) than some annoying fairy that treats you like a dumb ass all the way. Where is the realism in a NPC telling you to press some button? "Hey, listen". No, thanks.*
